Kotare Models - a New Venture from Former Wingnut Wings Staff

[Out2gtcha]

15 minutes ago, esarmstrong said:

IMHO, when making a model, if there is no allowance for an exposed engine, there is not a great deal of point in doing a model in 1/32 scale or larger, unless you are using short-run technology.  Eduard and many others have already given and are still giving us a very nice no-engine Spitfire family in quarter scale.  Revell did it with the Mark I & II Spitfire in 1/32 scale.  For this release, I hope Kotare will use the knowledge they gained creating the RR Merlin engine for the unreleased WNW Lancaster.  Just one man's opinion, TIFWIW.

 

I would wholeheartedly have to disagree with that.

 

Out of all the LSPs I've ever made since my 2nd modeling renaissance in 2007 I've not once made one with an exposed engine.

Honestly open panels like engine panels not only are unwanted, but IMHO down right spoil the lines of the aircraft. 

To me they are much harder to fit when separate, and the extra money spent on providing a detailing engine (s)could better spent in cockpit/exterior details or upgraded exterior parts.

[LSP_K2]

1 hour ago, Out2gtcha said:

 

I would wholeheartedly have to disagree with that.

 

Out of all the LSPs I've ever made since my 2nd modeling renaissance in 2007 I've not once made one with an exposed engine.

Honestly open panels like engine panels not only are unwanted, but IMHO down right spoil the lines of the aircraft. 

To me they are much harder to fit when separate, and the extra money spent on providing a detailing engine (s)could better spent in cockpit/exterior details or upgraded exterior parts.

 

I have to agree, 100%

[MikeC]

1 hour ago, Out2gtcha said:

 

I would wholeheartedly have to disagree with that.

 

Out of all the LSPs I've ever made since my 2nd modeling renaissance in 2007 I've not once made one with an exposed engine.

Honestly open panels like engine panels not only are unwanted, but IMHO down right spoil the lines of the aircraft. 

To me they are much harder to fit when separate, and the extra money spent on providing a detailing engine (s)could better spent in cockpit/exterior details or upgraded exterior parts.

 

6 minutes ago, LSP_K2 said:

 

I have to agree, 100%

 

+1.

The point about cost is well made.  The aftermarket will usually cater for the engines and other internal bits for those who want them (and there is nothing wrong in that, just different taste) and this means a simpler kit for those with other priorities.

[thierry laurent]

Actually in spite of the tons of released books the Spitfire is NOT well documented except some specific and quite standard marks such as the Mk.II, some Mk.V and the Mk.IX. For most other marks, the documentation is only average and totally insufficient for some others such as the Mk.I, the Mk.XII, the FR47 or the early PR versions! One stupid and very visible example: up to now nobody correctly documented the evolution of the wheels bumps in the upper wings!

[Pete Roberts]

Engine. Or no engine?

 

Why not both? Some of us like to have an engine to detail up. Some want to close the cowlings. 

 

So why not provide BOTH options? A fully detailed engine AND an option to just plug in a bit of engine so you can close the cowlings and still have somewhere to install the exhausts if you don’t want to assemble dozens of parts just to get this ability.

[Dpgsbody55]

2 hours ago, Pete Roberts said:

Engine. Or no engine?

 

Why not both? Some of us like to have an engine to detail up. Some want to close the cowlings. 

 

So why not provide BOTH options? A fully detailed engine AND an option to just plug in a bit of engine so you can close the cowlings and still have somewhere to install the exhausts if you don’t want to assemble dozens of parts just to get this ability.

 

Agreed.  Tamiya do this so well, as if you don't want to see the engine, you just build enough to support the prop, then glue the cowlings on.  On the other hand, the kit has all you want to build a well detailed engine in your well detailed plane.

 

This is what Kotare should be aiming at.

 

 

Cheers,

Michael

Edited September 17, 2021 by Dpgsbody55

[Gary Needham]

You are never going to please everyone and I personally prefer the 'clean' and simplistic lines of the aircraft itself like in the style of the Hasegawa 1/32 range of WW2 single seat aircraft. I don't like to model my aircraft with panels and engine cowls off etc. and looking at those online and at shows etc, that seems to be the majority of us. The problem with all the 'bells and whistles' like full engines and gun bays etc. is that it pushes the overall cost of the model up for (everyone) and I recall when I built the Tamiya Spitfire IX in 1/32, I left out all the engine and plumbing parts other than what was necessary to attach the spinner and thinking "how much would this kit have cost if all the parts not used along with the little magnets etc. had not been included?"

 

It's probably not economically (or moulding?) viable, but like with Zoukie Mura's 1/32 stuff, imagine if you could buy the base kit and just with those parts which add structural integrity and support and then another boxing for those who want everything 'open' or actually like painting and installing parts that will never be seen again.

 

Ultimately, the manufacturer has to make the final call and then we then have to decide whether to buy it or not. Either way, I am sure that Kotare Models Spitfire will be a superb package.

 

Gary

[MikeC]

2 hours ago, Pete Roberts said:

Engine. Or no engine?

 

Why not both? Some of us like to have an engine to detail up. Some want to close the cowlings. 

 

So why not provide BOTH options? A fully detailed engine AND an option to just plug in a bit of engine so you can close the cowlings and still have somewhere to install the exhausts if you don’t want to assemble dozens of parts just to get this ability.

Quite simply cost. If it's in the kit, it adds to the price. So why not leave it to the aftermarket, so those who don't want it don't have to pay for it? Of course, take that argument to its extreme and you'd end up with a 1950s-standard set of basic parts and have to rely on aftermarket for things like cockpits, but there's a balance - question is where is it?

[gwana]

1 hour ago, MikeC said:

Quite simply cost. If it's in the kit, it adds to the price. So why not leave it to the aftermarket, so those who don't want it don't have to pay for it? Of course, take that argument to its extreme and you'd end up with a 1950s-standard set of basic parts and have to rely on aftermarket for things like cockpits, but there's a balance - question is where is it?

Why not both? Eduard already does it. Armor manufacturers offer a "basic" kit, as well as their own branded add-on packs with extra detail. They can design the whole thing keeping the engine sprue and/or gun bay sprue separate. Sell upgrade packs (at a premium), then after a while bring out a Special Edition with those sprues in the box.

[Out2gtcha]

11 minutes ago, gwana said:

Why not both? Eduard already does it. Armor manufacturers offer a "basic" kit, as well as their own branded add-on packs with extra detail. They can design the whole thing keeping the engine sprue and/or gun bay sprue separate. Sell upgrade packs (at a premium), then after a while bring out a Special Edition with those sprues in the box.

 

Again, cost.  A startup company like Kotare is not Eduard. They may or may not have that money up front that a Tamiya or Eduard DOES have to spend. In that case, deleting a very expensive open and visible engine may be the difference between putting the model out and making money, and putting a model out, and loosing money.  It also costs a lot more money to make separate runs of kits, and when a company like this is starting out it seems a much better idea to keep things simple and accurate and sell a ton of kits VS dumping all your eggs in one basket with a "super kit" that does everything EVERYONE wants and pushes production costs so high that profit to make other kits is lost. 

[LSP_Mike]

It's going to come down to the vision of the principles involved.

[RLWP]

Based on nothing in particular...

 

I'd say having an engine will increase the market significantly. Not all modellers are LSP obsessives like we are, some like to build kits with a lot of content

 

Richard

[ade rowlands]

Engine, no engine, I’ll be buying it anyway. I prefer all hatches and panels closed myself, and a lot of the time the canopy too. If there’s an engine I’ll do what I do with the Tamiya kits, build as little of the engine as required to hang the Exhaust stubs and Prop off and slap the panels on. Same goes for gun bays. Doesn’t stop me marvelling at those who super detail though. 

[Out2gtcha]

Don't get me wrong, I do not think including extra detail in a kit is a bad thing, far from it. I'm simply saying there is a possibility that going with an uber expensive and ultimately detailed model for your first LSP may not be the best thing if you don't have an enormous budget to work with. 

[Kagemusha]

From their website:

 

Kotare's passion is to provide accurate and highly detailed scale model kitsets that are enjoyable to build for both experienced and novice modellers alike. We hope that by designing these models to be as trouble-free to build as possible we will attract even more people the relaxing and rewarding hobby of building scale models.