CRAZY IVAN5 Posted November 8, 2023 Share Posted November 8, 2023 13 hours ago, Shoggz said: It was in this thread https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/hyperscale/kotare-s-next-subject-speculation-p-51b-vs-p-51d-n-t540473.html Long story short. After someone declared that they hoped Kotare's next model would be a P-51B/C, a major argument, errr, discussion developed as to whether the P-51B/C had the same nose shape as the P-51D and if it didn't what was the cause of the difference. Someone suggested that it was the firewall that changed the shape, but Mr Roadrunner quite stridently argued that it wasn't! If that's no longer there, your hunch is probably correct and some judicious pruning has occurred! I read all that and what a damn mess, with all the usual suspects involved. I found it "entertaining" on one hand and silly on the other. There didn't seem to be any adults in the room. That's why I enjoy this forum so much, it's got it's characters but it's all good ! Out2gtcha and Archimedes 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mozart Posted November 8, 2023 Share Posted November 8, 2023 He may have left but his ghost still haunts us! Archimedes, Fanes, MikeC and 3 others 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shoggz Posted November 8, 2023 Share Posted November 8, 2023 1 hour ago, mozart said: He may have left but his ghost still haunts us! A Heil1g haunting? Archimedes, nmayhew, mozart and 4 others 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vince14 Posted November 8, 2023 Share Posted November 8, 2023 In other, non-ex member news, we probably won't find out what the new kit is at Telford as Kotare are not attending this year. nmayhew, Paul in Napier, Archimedes and 1 other 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shoggz Posted November 8, 2023 Share Posted November 8, 2023 That's a shame, but good news for those that haven't taken the Kotare plunge and snagged one of the initial kits yet. I'm slightly tempted to get another one, but must resist - I've built one and got two more in the stash already - and that's before I get the 'early' version! Archimedes and DonH 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony T Posted November 8, 2023 Share Posted November 8, 2023 The 20% off deal is tempting me into finally having a Kotare prrofile. On the codes, Mr J seems to be blue-blind. I had a friendly discussion where he similarly insisted FS 16473 was merely grey. Having asked officialdom about the paint mix in my writing days they confirmed it includes blue pigment. The Spitfire codes are more subtly blue but I like Kotare's artistic interpretation. Kinda fün. Tony Shoggz, Iain, Archimedes and 1 other 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christa Posted November 8, 2023 Share Posted November 8, 2023 One of the endearing features of Wingnut Wings was its pragmatic, elastic understanding of aircraft colours. Wise. Also, colour perception is not fixed between persons, nor is it necessarily constant for anyone over time, regardless of their involvement with model aircraft in any role or capacity. Perhaps a white Spitfire adorned with yellow polka dots would be interesting - large orange code letters, of course! Archimedes, CRAZY IVAN5 and Out2gtcha 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbk57 Posted November 8, 2023 Share Posted November 8, 2023 11 minutes ago, Christa said: One of the endearing features of Wingnut Wings was its pragmatic, elastic understanding of aircraft colours. Wise. Also, colour perception is not fixed between persons, nor is it necessarily constant for anyone over time, regardless of their involvement with model aircraft in any role or capacity. Perhaps a white Spitfire adorned with yellow polka dots would be interesting - large orange code letters, of course! I agree they I believe started with an open mind, some of which I suspect is they did not have near the self reinforced bias we have around WWII subjects. Many in the WWII area, consider themselves to be experts, the WWI field was a bit more fertile ground for a fresh open minded look. As such I think they have a culture of looking at things from scratch and not starting with assumptions. There is also here and there a real color photo from the time to go to. I really enjoy what they bring to the modeling world. Phantom2, Shoggz, MikeC and 5 others 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Out2gtcha Posted November 8, 2023 Share Posted November 8, 2023 1 hour ago, Christa said: One of the endearing features of Wingnut Wings was its pragmatic, elastic understanding of aircraft colours. Wise. Also, colour perception is not fixed between persons, nor is it necessarily constant for anyone over time, regardless of their involvement with model aircraft in any role or capacity. All good points. I think WnW also had some of the best overall instructions and documentation that were to be had anywhere. The gold guilded boxes also were a trivial but cool WnW addition. monthebiff, Christa, Uncarina and 3 others 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Roberts Posted November 8, 2023 Share Posted November 8, 2023 18 hours ago, rsanz said: This photo shows some good features of these Spitfires. Note the nose has a slight sheen and appears slightly darker? The Merlin was a very leaky engine and ground crew were continually wiping over the cowl panels which became quite oily, hence the sheen and darker appearance of the colours. Ground crew testimony post war also mentions grabbing pots of paint and touching up scratches and wear on the aircraft. This may explain the appearance of the wing leading edges. The wing root wear looks grey to my eyes - the Spitfire was given a coat of grey primer before the camouflage was applied. I’m not sure ground crew would let wear and tear get through to bare metal. The Official colour for code letters at this time was Medium Sea Grey. This was a paint prepared to service specifications. Some have suggested variations due to differences in mixing diligence. I’m not sure of that. This was brush painted on the aircraft. Christa, geedubelyer, Paul in Napier and 3 others 5 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeMaben Posted November 9, 2023 Share Posted November 9, 2023 (edited) There are inumerable factors involved in color perception. One that is rarely mentioned is light/lighting which itself is subject to inumerable factors. Source, direction, atmospherics, etc. It's an interesting subject and one that has me more confused when I'm finished than when I started. Edited November 9, 2023 by MikeMaben CRAZY IVAN5, Christa, geedubelyer and 2 others 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mozart Posted November 9, 2023 Share Posted November 9, 2023 Bottom line is, does it really matter? Paint the damn thing as you want to…..if it looks right to your eyes then it’s right! Christa, Tony T, GusM and 5 others 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quang Posted November 9, 2023 Share Posted November 9, 2023 54 minutes ago, MikeMaben said: It's an interesting subject and one that has me more confused when I'm finished than when I started. So what? I myself am in a perpetual state of confusion. Just learned to live with it. Out2gtcha, CRAZY IVAN5, MikeMaben and 1 other 2 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CRAZY IVAN5 Posted November 9, 2023 Share Posted November 9, 2023 I would just use the medium sea grey and be done with it, close enough for rock n roll. I'm not about to drive myself more crazy chasing it , heaven knows I did that chasing ww2 Japanese colors around the block. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CRAZY IVAN5 Posted November 9, 2023 Share Posted November 9, 2023 1 hour ago, MikeMaben said: There are inumerable factors involved in color perception. One that is rarely mentioned is light/lighting which itself is subject to inumerable factors. Source, direction, atmospherics, etc. It's an interesting subject and one that has me more confused when I'm finished than when I started. Oh how right you are, some colors are more prone to metamerism than others , whereas the same color looks different under different types of light. 2 that readily come to mind are Sky type S[ s meaning smooth or satin finish]and ww2 IJN J3 grey. It most definitely can get very confusing. I just get it in as close as I can and it d..u..n.. done. It helps to have an authentic color sample but again we're dealing with 75 -80 year old paint so there's that. Christa and MikeMaben 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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