Floyd S. Werner, Jr. Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 I am proofing the CAD for the Seahawks now along with about five other people. I take the suggestions that their research is bad or flawed. I take a lot of time and employ a lot of subject matter experts on these helicopter kits. Army guys are helping with the Army stuff. Air Force guys with the Air Force and Navy guys on the Seahawks. We are doing our best to find and correct any errors we see on the CAD. If you have an issue with the research phase of the Hawks, blame me. I am the point of contact for Kitty Hawk when it comes to helicopters. Any inaccuracies, I take full responsibility for. They draw it, we correct it until its released. Do we catch everything? No but we certainly do try. Me and my team take this job very seriously as we want the most accurate helicopter kits on the market period. I'd say Kitty Hawk's helicopters are some of the best on the market. Each one is getting better. You may not agree but they are the most accurate ones on the market right now. Floyd Fooesboy, Christoffer Lindelav, Harold and 5 others 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LSP_Kevin Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 Just for clarification, the prior comments were referring to Oliver and his building style. I was confused about that, too. Kev Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GMK Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 Just for clarification, the prior comments were referring to Oliver and his building style. As was I. Haven't bought a KH kit since the 1/48 F-35B - seemed solid. Don't have an opinion on KH helos, other than I'm glad that they're making them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hawkwrench Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 I will be the naysayer her to counteract you naysayers. Glen at Kitty Hawk has brought in probably the single most knowledgable person as far as modern American military helicopters go in Floyd Werner of Werner's Wings. Floyd lives, breathes, and works with helicopters, and has done so his entire adult life, first as a decorated Marine Cobra pilot, and now as a helicopter pilot for the Baltimore Police. He's also a world class modeler. He knows his stuff and he's helping bring greatness to Kitty Hawk's helicopters. Also, Kitty Hawk's latest releases have been decent. OS2U, F-86D/K, T-28B,C,D, OH-58, and the new Su-35, all are bloody decent. Haha! You called Floyd a Marine. You're in trouble now!!!! (He was Army) Tim Vandy 1 VX 4 and KAGNEW 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Roof Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 I am proofing the CAD for the Seahawks now along with about five other people. I take the suggestions that their research is bad or flawed. I take a lot of time and employ a lot of subject matter experts on these helicopter kits. Army guys are helping with the Army stuff. Air Force guys with the Air Force and Navy guys on the Seahawks. We are doing our best to find and correct any errors we see on the CAD. If you have an issue with the research phase of the Hawks, blame me. I am the point of contact for Kitty Hawk when it comes to helicopters. Any inaccuracies, I take full responsibility for. They draw it, we correct it until its released. Do we catch everything? No but we certainly do try. Me and my team take this job very seriously as we want the most accurate helicopter kits on the market period. I'd say Kitty Hawk's helicopters are some of the best on the market. Each one is getting better. You may not agree but they are the most accurate ones on the market right now. Floyd Personally speaking, I have never doubted the quality of the research or questioned the people behind it. It's the execution by KH that continues to be their problem. As I mentioned on ARC in a similar thread, other manufacturers have continually improved upon each release. For whatever reason(s), KH continues to make the same basic mistakes with each subsequent release. Knowing who's behind the research and how much is put into it, it's disappointing to continually have the "WTF were they thinking" thought when the kits are actually released. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Roof Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 I will be the naysayer her to counteract you naysayers. Glen at Kitty Hawk has brought in probably the single most knowledgable person as far as modern American military helicopters go in Floyd Werner of Werner's Wings. Floyd lives, breathes, and works with helicopters, and has done so his entire adult life, first as a decorated Marine Cobra pilot, and now as a helicopter pilot for the Baltimore Police. He's also a world class modeler. He knows his stuff and he's helping bring greatness to Kitty Hawk's helicopters. Also, Kitty Hawk's latest releases have been decent. OS2U, F-86D/K, T-28B,C,D, OH-58, and the new Su-35, all are bloody decent. Floyd is Army and KH has never released an OH-58. I'll refrain from commenting on another slightly incorrect sentence in there as the written sarcasm, friendly rib poking won't be taken as it's intended. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juggernut Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 Well i have been flying the Blackhawk for over 20 years and although he is an amazing scratchbuilder, some of the parts and panels are not correct. He has a good overall idea of the helo but some things are just fiction. It looks awesome and he does excellent work, however wrong is wrong. For us, the unwashed, can you be a little more specific? I worked the FMS Modification line at Sikorsky on S-70's (UH-60M's) and I've crawled all over and through those (Robbie tanks, hoist, FLIR, radar, mini-gun door gunner window mod) but they're not the MH(HH)-60G. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Roof Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 For us, the unwashed, can you be a little more specific? Simply put, Oliver uses artistic license in some of his scratch built parts. This is his preferred and unique building style, which in itself isn't wrong. His scratchbuilding and painting techniques are phenomenal and that is without question. However, the parts he creates should not always be used as a reference for others to replicate as some of it is 'made up'. Vandy 1 VX 4 and GMK 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LSP_K2 Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 Who is this Oliver you guys keep referring to? Is he a member here? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Roof Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 Who is this Oliver you guys keep referring to? Is he a member here? Yep........ http://forum.largescaleplanes.com/index.php?showtopic=52716 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Roof Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 Apologies. Any Army guy called a Marine should get puffed up a bit. I sure do. LOL Well, when you consider the fact that ARMY is an acronym for "Ain't Really a Marine Yet", they should get a bit puffed up! :D alaninaustria, Jack and Erick Swanberg 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Maxim Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 I am proofing the CAD for the Seahawks now along with about five other people. I take the suggestions that their research is bad or flawed. I take a lot of time and employ a lot of subject matter experts on these helicopter kits. Army guys are helping with the Army stuff. Air Force guys with the Air Force and Navy guys on the Seahawks. We are doing our best to find and correct any errors we see on the CAD. If you have an issue with the research phase of the Hawks, blame me. I am the point of contact for Kitty Hawk when it comes to helicopters. Any inaccuracies, I take full responsibility for. They draw it, we correct it until its released. Do we catch everything? No but we certainly do try. Me and my team take this job very seriously as we want the most accurate helicopter kits on the market period. I'd say Kitty Hawk's helicopters are some of the best on the market. Each one is getting better. You may not agree but they are the most accurate ones on the market right now. Floyd Floyd, thanks for your insight into KH. Perhaps you can suggest a Seaking to them when you speak with them. Many 32 scale modellers want one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John1 Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 Here's what I think is happening. You gave two teams. The American Team, and the Chinese Team. American Team is made up of designers, researchers, and experts. All are modelers and aviation fanatics. Chinese Team is King. They're the production team. The money's there. They have final veto power, so some dumb stuff gets injected into the mix. Stupid production decisions along the lines of breaking a 48 scale fuselage into six sections for no reason whatsoever. And ejector pin towers in the oddest of spots, although they've gotten better. But here's the rub. I build model flying machines. Out of resin and plastic. I don't assemble erector sets, I build models. That in itself involves some problem solving. I expect it. Maybe I should expect more? But I find KH kits accurate in shape with exquisite exterior detail. I can build on that. I tend to agree. The best research in the world won't salvage a kit if the production guys decide to cut corners. The two latest helos KH put out have good details, as would be expected given the experts that help them. Then the production folks decide (for whatever reason) to replace the prominent raised rivets which cover both these helos with hundreds of indented divots. In my view, you might as well just go back to raised panel lines while you are at it. To me, it completely ruins the surface texture on these helos. If they can do quality work like the latest Su they put out, should be no reason they can't replicate raised rivets in 35th scale. I really hope that they address this with the upcoming H-60 but quite honestly, I don't think they give a crap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Smitty44 Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 (edited) Apologies. Any Army guy called a Marine should get puffed up a bit. I sure do. LOL Sheesh, Canadian Army isn't part of the discussion, Ern Edited February 17, 2018 by Smitty44 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Williams Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 I think the reasons many manufacturers use recessed dimples instead of raised rivets are: 1. Many modelers prefer recessed detail as it's easier to restore after sanding and filling. Fill or wipe out a recessed rivet hole, and it's fairly easy to just drill a replacement, and finding a correct sized bit to match the remaining rivet holes is pretty easy. A bit harder to replace a raised rivet and make it look like all the others. 2. A lot of modelers like the artistic look with washes to emphasize recessed details, whether it's realistic or not. To be honest, I think a lot of modelers prefer recessed details, even if it's technically inaccurate, and I think the model companies are catering to that. Seems like we are already slagging a kit that doesn't yet exist (hello Trumpeter!). Instead of being happy that we are getting a big scale Seahawk, people are whining about it being 1/35 scale instead of 1/32 (if it were 1/32, others would whine about it being a different size than their Academy kits), whining about the possibility of the kit not having raised rivets (although others would whine about having to replace ones lost during sanding as they do on Apache and other kits), and talking about this “Oliver†guy, who I'm not sure what his actual involvement is in this upcoming kit. You can't make everyone happy. johncrow 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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