Meng and WnW

[Basta]

1 hour ago, DeanKB said:

NoNuts more like!

I've got to hand it to you, you really do have a knack for the unintentionally obscene. 

[LSP_Mike]

Wishing for the release of WNW  kits is understandable. They raised and set the bar for plastic model kits, and created fantastic kits of previously little known aircraft; they are their own trade currency. That said, if you missed them, you have limited options.  Would I like to see them again? Of course. I do not expect to anytime soon.

[DeanKB]

I think WNW kits will be released again, under a new brand. There is just too much money tied up in the moulds, and if PJ gets an offer to sell at least some of them, at some point he'll take the cash.

 

After all, he closed WNW because it was losing money, so he obviously cares about money. 

 

If he turns the money down, preferring to keep the moulds, then he's a very strange chap.

[Confusionreigns178]

According to a recent Australian modelling blog, during its eleven year existence, Wingnut Wings produced a total of 150,000 kits.  That figure sounds rather high to me, but could be an accurate one (I'm no expert on these matters, admittedly). 

 

Considering that anything in 1/32nd and First World War is in essence a "niche market" project, with prices to match, I would speculate that the real-world market for WNW kits has been saturated (and then some). This is not intended as any kind of insult to fans of WNW models - simply an observation of how most model-makers are likely to view the company's output. On a personal level, I will never buy their stuff (not my era), but I greatly admire the skill and good-workmanship that has been put into their products. 

 

Trumpeter claimed several years ago that they have sold 25,000 of their 1/32nd A-10 kits. That is a "mainstream" kit of a currently-in-service, unusual, eye-catching airframe with a number of unique "selling-points" (eg: the most powerful cannon ever put on an aircraft, sterling service in a number of recent conflicts, very good on-line media coverage, etc, etc).

 

I genuinely hope that the WNW moulds get re-used and their kits appear back on the shelves, regardless of the name of the boxes. I would definitely contemplate buying the Lancaster, but not at the kind of money some people have suggested it would be.  Time will tell on that one...

 

Chris. 

[Confusionreigns178]

2 hours ago, DeanKB said:

I think WNW kits will be released again, under a new brand. There is just too much money tied up in the moulds, and if PJ gets an offer to sell at least some of them, at some point he'll take the cash.

 

After all, he closed WNW because it was losing money, so he obviously cares about money. 

 

If he turns the money down, preferring to keep the moulds, then he's a very strange chap.

According to an Australian model-making blog, the real reason that WNW was shut down was because they hugely over-stretched themselves. They were trying to produce two versions of the Lancaster and the WW1 Gotha bomber at the same time. Some folks reckon the Lancs had been in development for nearly ten years, on their own.

 

With research and mould-production costs rising all the time, the blogger claimed that WNW found themselves in an un-sustainable financial situation. If this is accurate, then it is a very poor reflection on the company's management. 

 

This information was provided by an very experienced Australian journalist, who stated that all his information was confirmed by a minimum of two ex-WNW's employees. In other words, he felt that there was no speculation or conjecture occurring.

 

Additionally, Peter Jackson's personal wealth has been reported as being in the region of New Zealand $650 Million. Would keeping WNW going really have been such a huge financial burden for him? I find myself wondering...

 

Chris.   

[The Phantom]

Lancs would have been costed against the movie prop production as well as the development cost, would never use a modelling companies assets to do what a movie companies assets could do.

[Pup7309]

10 hours ago, thierry laurent said:

 I'm sure this is just a matter of time before seing at least the most popular coming back, albeit very probably in a simplified packaging.

True. This was starting to happen when they closed down

[Pup7309]

8 hours ago, Basta said:

Bingo, we have a winner. Anyone who has been sitting on full scale mock-ups of a Lancaster for years for a stillborn movie and trashes tens of millions in film sets is not likely to be pressed to sell off some obscure WW1 model moulds. Though this does beg the question of why he disbanded WNW in the first place... 

Exactly. He has the ultimate stash.  

[Pup7309]

It all comes down to what Sire PJ decides to do with his project, if he hasn’t already. And he ain’t saying diddly to no-one.

Edited December 2, 2020 by Pup7309

[MikeMaben]

11 hours ago, cbk57 said:

 I can afford to buy a kit like this, I could even build it,(it would take me a year or two) but I could never display such a thing in my home and it would take too much space in my workshop. 

 

                   

 

 

[Confusionreigns178]

13 hours ago, vince14 said:

I think PJ is quite protective of his IP, he had almost all of the sets for the LotR destroyed so they couldn’t be used in other films and the full-scale Lancaster reproductions he had made for the (now dead) Dambusters film are still languishing in a warehouse in China. It wouldn’t surprise me at all if he retained the molds.

 

Honestly, I believe all these rumours about the molds resurfacing are either wishful thinking or mischief.

The complete destruction of movie sets is just about standard practice in the industry, to be frank. I don't think the producers want to pay for transportation or long-term storage. Also, you have to factor in that - from the producers point-of-view - it's very unlikely that they can re-use a set for a sequel (but not impossible). 

 

I've always thought it was a huge shame that the "Space Jockey" set from the original Alien movie was simply cut up and thrown in a number of skips - that would certainly get my vote for the film-set most worthy of preservation. I've read that filming finished on a Saturday and the Jockey set was destroyed and binned by the following Monday afternoon. The studio space was booked for another film and so it just had to go. 

 

On a different note, I've heard a story about some of the actors who worked on the original Star Wars movies. Apparently, many of them lived in the Borehamwood area (where Elstree Studios are based). Some of the actors were befriended by an individual who claimed to be writing a book about the first three films and some were persuaded to part with props they had "borrowed" from the sets. This was on the understanding that this person would photograph them and return the props to their owners. Not too surprisingly, they never heard from this "charming" individual again. 

 

Chris.

[vince14]

There is a difference, though, between sets being destroyed because they were not intended to be used again and sets being destroyed specifically because the Director ordered it to happen because he didn't want anyone else using them.

 

Unless someone comes out with proof that they've bought the moulds - or PJ announces that he's re-opening WNW - the endless speculation about their future is utterly pointless.

[DeanKB]

4 hours ago, Confusionreigns178 said:

According to an Australian model-making blog, the real reason that WNW was shut down was because they hugely over-stretched themselves. They were trying to produce two versions of the Lancaster and the WW1 Gotha bomber at the same time. Some folks reckon the Lancs had been in development for nearly ten years, on their own.

 

With research and mould-production costs rising all the time, the blogger claimed that WNW found themselves in an un-sustainable financial situation. If this is accurate, then it is a very poor reflection on the company's management. 

 

This information was provided by an very experienced Australian journalist, who stated that all his information was confirmed by a minimum of two ex-WNW's employees. In other words, he felt that there was no speculation or conjecture occurring.

 

Additionally, Peter Jackson's personal wealth has been reported as being in the region of New Zealand $650 Million. Would keeping WNW going really have been such a huge financial burden for him? I find myself wondering...

 

Chris.   

PJ's immense wealth sure does muddy the waters around whether he'd sell.

 

But the coronavirus was the trigger for PJ to shut WNW & TVAL, and sacking all the staff was done to save money. Plus the movie industry has ground to a halt to a large degree, and PJ sent accountants in to run WNW, so the financials must have bothered him.

 

So I think it may be that PJ was  subsidising WNW - to what degree we'll never know, but it's on record that it wasn't there to make a profit - and he decided, in light of the global crisis & recession, to minimise his losses, despite being worth several hundred million.

 

Jackson recently sold one third of Weta Digital to Sean Parker, US billionaire. Parker's former  employee, a former financial analyst, is now CEO of Weta. So he needed cash.

 

Plus PJ has launched Weta Animated, a new company to make original animated movies. That needs cash as well.

 

Plus PJ decided to give MENG the Fokker moulds, rather than pay them in cash - why do so, if you're so attached to the moulds that you're going to keep them?

 

To me, PJ has taken a long, hard look at his finances and made some changes, designed to reduce his outgoings and increase his income.

 

I still feel that, at some point, his finance people will convince him to sell the WNW moulds, as it's money on the shelf, wasting.

[vince14]

19 minutes ago, DeanKB said:

Plus PJ decided to give MENG the Fokker moulds, rather than pay them in cash - why do so, if you're so attached to the moulds that you're going to keep them?

It's not as simple as that. WNW owed money to MENG for the work they had done, allowing them to use the moulds was part of the deal for them to re-coup their costs. From what I've heard PJ wasn't opposed to the deal as he didn't consider the Dr.I to be a 'proper' WNW kit as it had never been released under the WNW banner.

 

The same could have been true for the HP 0/100 and Lanc, but those moulds are held by pure injection moulding companies who have no intention of moving into the kit production business.

 

WNW was a plaything for a very rich man that was always doomed to fail if he pulled the plug. There's always a small chance that the moulds might be used again in future, but right now it seems very unlikely. 

[Bob MDC]

Try turning it round and looking at it from the WNW injection moulding company (company X).

So you have been working for WNW for many years then the work stops !  one. that buggers up your cash flow, you now have a huge amount of moulds to store (correctly) plus you have a lot of tooling costs on 3 new projects two of them large projects with multiple test shots, question how do we get payed , stop gap easy fix Fokker Dr1 easy quick and get some cash flow, time to sort out cost of mould storage and the large projects which have not come to market .

Having a bit of insight into the world of PJ as I was involved with all the original miniatures for LotR when we worked for "the evil empire" WW 1 stuff is really close to his heart and I don't think he would walk away from it but as he has created WNW I don't think he will want it to disappear.

 

and !! from company X you have a lot of moulds to store production /pre-production work to find including two major projects with zero income , it makes an interesting point on your business model.

When company X runs into the red on the WNW project it should get interesting !!!

 

I had a bit of a tally today we have 15 companies which we have masters and moulds for I contact them after a year and the moulds are kept till they are no longer viable, but we have boxes of patteren's that we have to store, even with three large barns we would struggle to store the Wingnut stuff !

( one of the projects is a 1/72 HMS Caroline fittings  that is the last survivor from Jutland)

 

Bob