Tnarg Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 Realistically, these guys are apparently offering Martin's design work as released kits. We have the choice to buy them or wait until someone else comes up with a better alternative, which is not likely to happen. If we buy from this company, we support their profits on top of Martin's back. If we pay them, will they have the cash to invest in more tooling in the future? Will they then release the rest of the design work Martin did? Maybe. Will they release anything new that matches in quality? That remains to be seen and is probably a year or two away. It seems that we want the kits, and I know I do. On the other hand I don't want to let Martin go unrewarded. A boycott will realistically only hurt me, just like throwing a temper tantrum does for my kids or grandkids. They will still sell these even if all of LSP decided not to buy them. My take on the solution would be a Paypal account where I could throw a donation to Martin for every one of those kits in question, keeping some of the funding going his way to make sure his future releases also come out. That way I get my kits and the new ones too. (Sort of like the proverbial cake, I guess). Anyone? Martin? Anyone? OK, not many of us are flush with cash, or have a wife or girlfriend who tolerates our spending desires. We are all usually after the best deal in town, but if we all shop only at Walmart, then we will only get to shop at Walmart. You get what you pay for in the end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kagemusha Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 Well I'm pleased to see the B-25J being released, prefer it to the C/D. Over the moon about the Meteor too. A 1/32 Lanc... Jeez, the hairs on the back of my neck are standing to attention! Sod the fact the images are a bit iffy, and one wing's longer than the other etc., if you look at the "about us bit" on the website it's quite possible they know their onions, and if the kit turns out to be an upscaled highly accurate 1/48 kit I don't really give a flying... How will I get to sleep tonight, how? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Peterpools Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 We are a very small slice of the buying public and whether we buy their kits or not, will most likely mean nothing at all. I've waited a long time for the B-25 and would rather purchase it from Martin, if I knew when that would be. I'm in no rush to buy the Mitchell and hopefully will have options when I'm ready. Peter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
williamj Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 So as to not be misunderstood, I'll barely be able to find the space to display one, and only one, very large scale plane, and for me, that just has to be the Fortress. Now if I lived in a mansion, I'd probably buy four of each. Before any $ is sent for a "lank" or "Meteor" I will wait for a close look..but think they will get sumpin. very excited about these two on the list. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DougN Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 (edited) I find all the "stolen" and "ripped off" comments interesting, but probably out of place. Martin never said he got ripped off, nor did he ever say what exactly did cause his involvement in the project to stop. Of course it is his right to say what he wants to, but it has led to lots of unfounded speculation. That being said, here is a different take. I wonder at the feasibility of producing a limited run large kit like a B25 for $139 retail. Having recently gone through pricing for injected molded kits, I can't make the math work. At $139 retail, the distributors are paying the company approx $62 per kit. Now, each sprue in the kit likely costs at least $5 to $10 each for metal molds (approx $10K per mold), and the complexity of the parts (maybe more) and @11 sprues we are at $55 to $110 just with that. Add to that the cost of decals ($3 to $5 per kit); the cost of any PE (another couple bucks) as well as CAD costs, box art and instructions, as well as shipping kit sprues halfway around the world, and then completed kit boxings to distributors, I can't see the math adding up to any profit. Perhaps that is the reason Martin is not involved in the project anymore? Perhaps the HK models folks are the ones that got stuck with the molds, and are now trying to recoup their costs. Did anyone ever think of that? So, in the end, we don't know one way or another who did what to whom, and as Martin has not said or claimed he has been ripped of. So, can we please dispense with the "stolen" "ripped off" and other subtly racist comments and stick to discussion about the kit itself? Doug Edited February 1, 2012 by DougN Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Propwash Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 Well, now we know. I've had an itchy feeling lately that Martin's kits would re-emerge sometime soon. Just wish there was more information about pricing and availability. Will I buy these kits? Probably, but I want to hold off until I have more information. Should be at least a couple months before they're availabe in the U.S. or Europe. Plenty of time to decide if they're worthy of our heard-earned Dollars/Pounds/Euros, etc. My personal view is, in the event these kits live up to our expectations, we owe it to Martin to buy them, since without his efforts they wouldn't exist. By so doing, we are indirectly showing him the thanks he deserves for his innovation and far-sightedness, not to mention encouraging the development of additional kits of this type. Jerry Peterson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob MDC Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 Hi, I saw one of the B25J's at a local IPMS meeting tonight looks very good I think it was going to be well excess of £100 and the Lanc and B17 are over £250 I think the Manchester conversion may be a bit of a luxury. ATB Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mgbooyv8 Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 (edited) Hi Guys, The HK website says: "...formed by a group of enthusiasts with modelers, Military fans and experienced mold maker. Combining with our historical knowledge..." Anyone noticed the B-17 propellers on the Lancaster drawing? Anyway, I'm interested in Martins comments on apparently the forthcoming release of his kits. Cheers, Peter Edited February 2, 2012 by mgbooyv8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Wing XL (Martin) Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 Hello all, Let me comment on this interesting subject a bit too. I agree with one of the persons above, that the new models should be judged for what will be eventually in the box and not unimportantly.....what you have to pay for it. I know there is a history, but that is the past and we all should move on, which I personally already did. Busy already with establishing the new brand WingXL, which is still in progress. So let we just have fun......talk about the models....the new releases from every other manufacturers.......and enjoy our hobby is alive and kicking. Another new manufacturer is only and always to the benefit of you ...... the plastic modellers. Now kits appear in 1/32 we all would not have thought possible a few years ago. It increases our choices. Everybody can choose freely acc. their own criteria, relevances and priorities. It pushes every manufacturer to increase the standards at any time. Called ......progress !!! I would say.....GREAT !!!!! I must say I have respect that they showing some "balls" by releasing the 1/32 4-engined big ones ! I know many other manufacturers had these subjects on the tables and always pushes them of the tables because they are regarded as "risky". In that respect for not doing that.....I like these guys !!!!! I honestly wish them good luck. Because they will really need it. I am curious with what they will come up after these items. Then a manufacturer shows if it has originality, creativity, eye for relevant details and the overall quality to succeed in a longterm. That applies to every manufacturer, also my oncoming WingXL. Yes.....WingXL will release 2 kits too ........ THIS YEAR. One of them will be the 1/32 B-25C/D Mitchell. The construction and level of detail of our B-25C/D is different and has been improved. More news about that later. Sorry, you have to have a bit more patience with that yet. In the meantime.....happy and safe plastic modelling !!! Greetings, Martin WingXL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phasephantomphixer Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 I'd like to ask if I may, What DID happen back then? Not to pry into their business situation, but so I can make a clear and informed decision on whether to make purchases from this company. If there is a background story I want to know for my own conscious that such a purchase would be okay and not feeding corruption within the hobby. Was the "parting" equal and legit? Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michel borderline Beekveld Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 You know Martin, the B 25 doesn't really do anything for me. But i'm still gonna get it as soon as it comes out. I'm gonna pay for it. In real money. If by that time the Euro still exists. And as soon as my favorite South- African can get it in his store.. MBB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Artful69 Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 I found this on Britmodeller. Stolen 1/32 B-25J Mitchell http://data4.primeportal.net/models/thomas_voigt6/hk_models/images/hk_models_1_of_1.jpg This is BIG WTF Holy Cow type news!!!!!!!!!!!! I'll have one of each!!!!! Who hoo!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Peterpools Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 Thank you Martin for the update and insight. I'm curious as to the what and when of their B-25 and will have an open mind and as I said before, will wait and see. Now hat I know your B-25C/D will be available this year, I will be able to compare and make an intelligent choice. Peter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Artful69 Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 Well I'm pleased to see the B-25J being released, prefer it to the C/D. Over the moon about the Meteor too. A 1/32 Lanc... Jeez, the hairs on the back of my neck are standing to attention! Sod the fact the images are a bit iffy, and one wing's longer than the other etc., if you look at the "about us bit" on the website it's quite possible they know their onions, and if the kit turns out to be an upscaled highly accurate 1/48 kit I don't really give a flying... How will I get to sleep tonight, how? lmao ... I was wondering about their Lanc CAD pics too ... the thing that stood out to me was the top turret?!?! ... reminicent of the Short Stirling's job rather than the Lanc?? ... well lets see how their 1st mock up looks eh??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pfuf Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 I have more then enough kits to be patient Martin and curios to see the improved design hope this include raised rivets. Johan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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