red Dog Posted February 7, 2023 Author Share Posted February 7, 2023 1 hour ago, thierry laurent said: Hi Olivier. Actually I have the opposite experience! When using thin plastic sheet the Tamiya glue is eating the plastic edge and leaving a slightly irregular result whereas Klear obviously does not and does not leave anything thick enough under a coat of primer. I guess this is probably linked to the way each of us is using the different products. As far as something works this is good! Interesting indeed. Do you dilute your klear? I found mine way too thick for that. Varnish as well. I never was a big fan of klear, messed too many tests (and a few models with it) so I don't use it often Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeMaben Posted February 7, 2023 Share Posted February 7, 2023 If Klear is anything like Future (so I've heard) you should be able to thin it with 91% acohol. Rockie Yarwood and red Dog 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Talon Posted February 7, 2023 Share Posted February 7, 2023 (edited) 1 hour ago, red Dog said: Interesting Talon. I'd love to hear how you do it? I guess you have a special tool for that? It seems a pretty convenient solution for fixing indeed the rivets destroyed by sanding. Call me stupid but I'd love to get your how to It is actually a very easy process and allows you to produce hundreds of rivets of your chosen diameter to a consistent size quickly and easily. I can produce around 200 rivets in a minute. Process is to find a piece of metal (end of a drill bit, wire, rod, tube) that is the diameter of the rivets you want to produce. Insert that into a hobby knife handle such as an X-Acto blade handle. Lay a piece of lead foil on a piece of cloth - I use an old white cotton t-shirt. Use the piece of metal in the handle to repeatedly punch the lead foil, which will produce numerous domed rivets the diameter you need. The foil I have is red on one side and a friend gave me a lifetime supply (they are unused wine bottle tops). The red is useful to see which way up to apply the rivet, and to show me when they are glued. I attach with Tamiya Extra Thin, and then fix in place with a coat of Mr Surfacer. If they take a very rough knock they may come off, but are pretty easy to replace and I've not really had any issues with knocking them. Here is a 1/72 AAV-7 using the technique for the applique reactive armour bolts showing how easily the technique allows you to scale size. The basic tools (this drill bit is .6mm diameter so quite large rivets) And after about a second of work - rivets ready to apply. Note that I have turned these over, so the red domed side is up. The side of the foil that is facing down is the side that will have the dome. Edited February 7, 2023 by Talon Rockie Yarwood, easixpedro, CShanne and 10 others 9 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
red Dog Posted February 7, 2023 Author Share Posted February 7, 2023 Many thanks Talon for taking the time to explain. I was somehow seeing a dome kind of rivet and was wondering if you punched these then the contact surface to the model should be pretty small and hence very difficult have them stick correctly on the model. But am I right to assume that the rivets you punch are flat - which makes them easy to stick on plastic? Talon 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Talon Posted February 7, 2023 Share Posted February 7, 2023 The back is more or less flat and the top has a domed shape to it. The smaller the diameter of rivet, the more pronounced the dome is Greg W and red Dog 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
red Dog Posted February 7, 2023 Author Share Posted February 7, 2023 thanks for all that Talon, I'll definitely try this out. Derek B 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thierry laurent Posted February 7, 2023 Share Posted February 7, 2023 You get exactly the same result with a grainer tool but in that case you can use plastic as well to get dome-shaped rivets (the tip of each punch being concave). My set has 16 different diameters. I'm punching rivets over an thick industrial rubber square mat I got it many years ago (from a modeller working for Caterpillar!). This is very efficient. I'm wondering which "Klear" you used. In Belgium they used to sell a milky and thicker Johnson "Klir" that was a similar but different product. I purchased my bottles of Klear years ago while being on vacation in Scotland. This possibly explains that. I'm never thinning it as it is like water. red Dog and Derek B 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
red Dog Posted February 7, 2023 Author Share Posted February 7, 2023 What is a grainer tool? Google sends me weird stuff to make rivets My Klear is indeed Johnson "Klir" bought in Belgium a long while ago It's definitely not like water, way thicker indeed Landrotten Highlander and Derek B 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phasephantomphixer Posted February 7, 2023 Share Posted February 7, 2023 2 hours ago, MikeMaben said: If Klear is anything like Future (so I've heard) you should be able to thin it with 91% acohol. Johnson wax Future or Klear is thinned with Ammonia. Pure clear Ammonia, not "sudsy" or "Lemon scent" which back in the day was readily available, but now may be a bit tough to find. It is also a good way to remove it, but test an area first. AND if you shoot it thinned through an airbrush, be sure to flush and clean the airbrush right away as the Ammonia can attack the chrome coating. red Dog 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phasephantomphixer Posted February 7, 2023 Share Posted February 7, 2023 1 hour ago, thierry laurent said: You get exactly the same result with a grainer tool but in that case you can use plastic as well to get dome-shaped rivets (the tip of each punch being concave). My set has 16 different diameters. I'm punching rivets over an thick industrial rubber square mat I got it many years ago (from a modeller working for Caterpillar!). This is very efficient. I'm wondering which "Klear" you used. In Belgium they used to sell a milky and thicker Johnson "Klir" that was a similar but different product. I purchased my bottles of Klear years ago while being on vacation in Scotland. This possibly explains that. I'm never thinning it as it is like water. Sounds like what I know as Jeweler's Beading tool set. Wasn't cheap, but very nice set with friction handle that leaves a circle on surface, or can be used firmly as you explained. red Dog 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thierry laurent Posted February 7, 2023 Share Posted February 7, 2023 Here it is Olivier: https://www.amazon.com.be/-/en/Pieces-Beading-Diamond-Jewelry-Equipment/dp/B097SYV8HS/ref=sr_1_4?crid=1WNJ3W6ADDM8T&keywords=outil+de+perlage+bijoux&qid=1675773284&sprefix=beading+tool+jewellry%2Caps%2C151&sr=8-4 And it has 24 diameters as mine (not 16 as I thought without checking) Hth Thierry Greg W and red Dog 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
red Dog Posted February 7, 2023 Author Share Posted February 7, 2023 Merci Thierry Derek B and thierry laurent 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmel Posted February 7, 2023 Share Posted February 7, 2023 I love this thread. I eagerly await your next round of pics. Great work! Jake red Dog 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
red Dog Posted February 7, 2023 Author Share Posted February 7, 2023 Thanks Jake, that last update was clearly made possible thanks to your help Derek B 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Finn Posted February 7, 2023 Share Posted February 7, 2023 Here is some rivet details in full scale: https://www.docdroid.com/AwvlaY3/general-aircraft-structural-repair-manual-pdf#page=40 Jari Derek B and red Dog 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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