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Pup7309

WNW is nowhere near the end of its run...!

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22 hours ago, Radub said:

That is just because the decal sheet is so sparse that they had to fill it with something. It is part of a kit, it is not "a decal sheet for a competitor". That is no "proof" of a "rule". And in any case, there is no "rule" that WNW will never ever issue a Dr.I.

Oh Radu, you complain about people making things up about WNW but then go right ahead and make something up yourself. You know that saying they included decals for the Roden Dr.I 'just because the decal sheet is so sparse that they had to fill it with something' is utter nonsense, right? This is the decal sheet in question, with the Dr.I markings highlighted - they're about 25% of the total area of the decal sheet, so hardly 'space filler'. And that's before we consider why they'd go to the time and expense of making them just to fill a decal sheet - surely you'd save the money and just make the sheet smaller if you were a traditional model company, right? 

 

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And you're just playing semantics by saying 'It is part of a kit, it is not "a decal sheet for a competitor"' - you know very well that STWilliams meant that they included decals for a competitor manufacturer's kit in one of their own products. Besides which, WNW didn't have to include the decals for the Roden Dr.I at all. They could have easily left them out. It doesn't mean that they are now abiding by some rule that means they'll never release a Dr.I - in fact the instruction sheet for the kit even says 'Recommended model (as at April 2018) is Roden 601 1/32 Fokker Dr.I. So make what you will out of the words 'as at April 2018'.

 

It does prove that they're not a traditional manufacturer, though, unless you can show me another example of where a company has included decals in one of their own kits for a model that they don't produce, but a rival company does.

Edited by vince14

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1 hour ago, vince14 said:

It does prove that they're not a traditional manufacturer, though, unless you can show me another example of where a company has included decals in one of their own kits for a model that they don't produce, but a rival company does.

 

I don't have to "prove" anything.

I am not the one treating WNW like a "cult" with a "messiah" (PJ), revelations (interviews taken as gospel), and commandments (rules about what they "do" and "do not do"). I am fully aware that I blasphemed in some of the cultists eyes, but I do not believe any of the BS peddled about them. I refuse to drink the Kool Aid. I love their products and I bought a lot of them. I demonstrated in my replies that all the so-called "rules" about WNW are pure BS. You believe whatever you want. :-) 

Radu  

Edited by Radub

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On 2/9/2019 at 2:19 PM, LSP_Mike said:

Since WNW has become the benchmark for 1/32

 

Hmmm, until the WNW Lanc is actually released, Tamiya hold that title as much as WNW in my view.

 

Most of their WWI kits are actually rather simple - beautiful, but still ultimately simple in terms of kit engineering

 

and before all the WNWers get their rigging in a twist, this is *not* a criticism of WNW, just a reflection of their subject matter.

 

The Lanc will obviously change all that.

 

just my 2c of course...

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On 2/12/2019 at 6:02 PM, ringleheim said:

Is it just me? It seems like WNW generates an enormous amount of conversation at this forum, but very little in the way of build threads or finished models!

 

 

 

not on here anyway

 

i think you'll find there's a lot on LSM...

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21 minutes ago, Pup7309 said:

Could the extra Dr1 decals be for a future kit? 

 

Now there’s a thought!

To "recap", that is the "nub" of the "riposte" from some here. Apparently, when asked if they were doing a Dr.I, Richard Alexander replied "there is one already on the market". Some concluded that this was in line with the BS "rule" that "WNW never ever issues kits made by others" (Lancaster much?) and that WNW will never ever issue a Dr.I. I am quite certain that WNW will eventually issue a Dr.I. That stupid made-up "rule" has been breached by WNW many times (again, Lancaster!). When (not if) the Dr.I will be released I will relish in watching these people try to justify how it breached their BS "rule". :-)

Radu

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1 hour ago, Radub said:

To "recap", that is the "nub" of the "riposte" from some here. Apparently, when asked if they were doing a Dr.I, Richard Alexander replied "there is one already on the market". Some concluded that this was in line with the BS "rule" that "WNW never ever issues kits made by others" (Lancaster much?) and that WNW will never ever issue a Dr.I. I am quite certain that WNW will eventually issue a Dr.I. That stupid made-up "rule" has been breached by WNW many times (again, Lancaster!). When (not if) the Dr.I will be released I will relish in watching these people try to justify how it breached their BS "rule". :-)

Radu

...unless they fiddle around and wait too long and another company (Copperstate :whistle:) comes along and beats them to the punch.  Not trying to hijack a thread, but based on the Nieuport 17 kit they did, this seems a possibility.

Edited by esarmstrong

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But will they ever release French aircraft?

 

 

 

- just doing my part to keep this meaningless and yet very entertaining thread alive. 

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Guest DannyVM
1 minute ago, John1 said:

But will they ever release French aircraft?

No need to do so, CSM all ready do their job, and they do it like real pro's. That said, hopefully they don't stall with these two kit's.;);)

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2 hours ago, cbk57 said:

Will WNW go out of business before this thread ends?  :BANGHEAD2:

 

It is like a slow motion train wreck, I can't help but watch.

Sounds like a good title for another new thread.

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8 hours ago, nmayhew said:

 

Hmmm, until the WNW Lanc is actually released, Tamiya hold that title as much as WNW in my view.

 

Most of their WWI kits are actually rather simple - beautiful, but still ultimately simple in terms of kit engineering

 

and before all the WNWers get their rigging in a twist, this is *not* a criticism of WNW, just a reflection of their subject matter.

 

The Lanc will obviously change all that.

 

just my 2c of course...

Couldn't agree more, I have a fair few WnW in the stash and love building them but they are nowhere near Tamiya levels of engineering and sometimes you have to wonder if the guys at WnW ever build any of their own test shots as stuff doesn't fit, overly tight etc and the latest Halberstadt sprue's have an awful lot of flash for a brand new state of the art kit . Don't get any of that with Tamiya stuff.

 

Regards.Andy 

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On 2/15/2019 at 9:58 AM, Radub said:


Hmmm... Most of that is not really true. You are just repeating the usual made-up "rules" about WNW, which have little basis in reality. We can answer the questions in the order you asked them:
 

Q: Why no Be.2, Dr.I, DH.4, Jenny, Nieuports, SPADS, early Albie's, Caudrons, Breguets, Farmans, Macchis, Avro 504k, Short seaplanes, 1 & 1/2 Strutter, Gunbus, etc, etc?

A: Can you show me the place where they said that these kits will never be issued "in perpetuity of the universe"? Who dictated that these kits will never be issued? WNW never said that - you mentioned their "secrecy" (will come round to that later). Just because these kits don't exist it does not mean they won't exist at some stage in the future. 

 

Q: Why allow popular kits to sell out?
A: Why not? It is a ringing endorsement of their success that their kits sell out. Bravo! That is what any manufacturer dreams of. There is nothing that gives more nightmares to a manufacturer than a full warehouse and no customers. 

 

Q: Why not make larger runs, or make further runs?

A: Costs. Storage. Efficiency. Staying "nimble" in a fickle market. Tons of reasons. 

 

Q: Why kit planes with little demand?

A: This is a multi-layered doozie! You said their stuff sells out. You said they make stuff in small runs. So, I see no major risks if there is "litle demand". BTW, what do you mean by "little demand"? Just because you do not want it? They all seem to sell well. And anyway, modellers like to 617ch and moan that "why is that manufacturer making only popular subjects? When are they going to make the less popular models that were never kitted?". WNW are making those models in little demand that modellers ask for. So, if this "little demand" label is true, you cannot possibly hold this against them. 

 

Q: Why no marketing?

A: This is an outright lie. I subscribe to a few scale model magazines. WNW took back-cover (most expensive) adverts for their kits. They also have adverts inside the magazines. They send samples for review to magazines and websites. They have a website where they display models by their customers. They attend trade shows. They have stands at model shows where they had out marketing materials. As a matter of fact, from that point of view WNW have more marketing than Tamiya. 

 

Q: Why just release kits with no warning?

A: This is an outright lie. They always announce the models a few months before they are available for sale. That is why they have pre-orders. They just announced the Lancaster months before it will be available. Often they issue clear WARNINGS that kits will be announced at certain dates. They place a blank place-holder on their website where they will later place the announcement. In Telford this year, on day one of the show they "warned" that they would announce a new model the next day - that was the Handley-Page O/400, yet another model announced before the released date. 

 

Q: Why ignore subjects that would sell in large numbers?
A: What? You just said their stuff sells out! Their stuff sells in large numbers already! And again, I return to my first answer: if there is something that you want and they have not released it yet, who dictated that such a kit would never be issued in the future? 

 

Q: Why the secrecy?

A: Fair play to them! They are entitled to maintain their plans under wraps. This is not different from Tamiya or any other manufacturer. Loose lips sink ships. 

 

Q: Why provide decals for competitors kits?

A: I am not aware of such a product. I can't find it on their website. 

 

Q: Why the reluctance to make kits of already released subjects?

A: Not true. There have been previous kits of SE5a, Camel, Fokker DVII, Fokker III, Pfalz DIII, DH.2 from other manufacturers. 

 

Q: Why the Anglo-German infatuation? 

A: And American subjects. Also they have a kit of a French Salmson. 

 

You ended with this: 

Q: This doesn't seem to be a "traditional kit manufacturer", as I know of no other manufacturer that operates like WNW. Companies tend to want to maximise profits, & I'm pretty sure WNW are not doing that. Making money - probably - but not maximising profits.

A: Almost all manufacturers operate like WNW. I am quite certain that WNW is not making a loss. They have a great product that never clogs the shelves. It is a success story. Long may that continue. 

 

Radu 

In answer:

 

1.The point is that WNW are not releasing kits, like the Dr.I, BE.2c, Jenny, etc, that will sell in huge numbers. Why? "Traditional" model manufacturers make profits. They maximise profits. Why turn away from making profits and release something like the DFW & Pflaz D.XII, which are hardly in demand? They'll probably release them sometime - I'm not claiming any "rules" that stop them doing so - but why not release a Dr.I now? It'll sell like hot cakes.

 

2. "Traditional" manufacturers maximise profits. That's their raison d'etre. Having smaller production runs than demand warrants is just crazy - it's turning money away. The risk of having kits and no buyers is a risk of being in business, but selling out repeatedly is just not the way to run a business - not a "traditional" business.

 

3. "Tons of reasons", but with WNW kits selling out time after time, it's obvious that WNW are not making enough kits. "Costs, storage and efficiency"  are outweighed by revenue. What other "traditional" kit manufacturers allow a significant percentage of their entire production catalogue to sell out time after time, in a relatively short time?

 

4. I'm not holding the "little demand" kits against WNW. I love them! But it's not what a "traditional manufacturer" would do. It fails to maximise revenue and profits.

 

5. WNW's marketing is minimal. Tamiya have their own magazine, they trail new kits months in advance. WNW's don't. They have taken magazine ads, but not very many & not regularly. They didn't even sell via wholesalers until relatively recently.

 

6. WNW's released not one, but three boxing's of the Felixstowe - with no warning whatsoever. They have "Christmas Surprises" regularly. They have recently trailed a few kits, but that's not the norm - you are obviously a little late to WNW.

 

7. Again, that's what "traditional" manufacturers do. They sell kits with the most demand. I love WNW kitting weird subjects. I prefer it. But why do they do it, it doesn't maximise revenue? Because Peter Jackson wanted that kit. That's not "traditional".

 

8. The secrecy runs , for many kits, until they are released. No pre-marketing. Why? It's not "traditional", other manufacturers market their releases months and months in advance.

 

9. You know it's a DR.I decal included in a kit boxing, stop being facetious.

 

10. The SE.5a was being kitted before Roden released theirs. Same with the DH.2. The Pfalz D.III of Roden is a different kit to the D.IIIa. The Fokker D.VII & E.III are truly awful Battle Axe kits that are avoided like the plague. Same with the Camel. Again, it's not a "rule" - my point is that "traditional" manufacturers kit the most in demand aeroplanes.

 

11. A single French aeroplane, and a fairly innocuous one at that, when demand for Neiuports and SPAD's has been ignored - again, not very "traditional". Why?

 

12. My entire point is you claim that WNW are a "traditional" manufacturing company. The points I've raised above illustrate why, in my opinion, they are not. It's nothing to do with "rules", or breaking rules - it's just that they don't operate like other manufacturers.

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