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Copper State Models 1/32 Nieuport N. 17

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10 hours ago, DeanKB said:

 

...However, I fear those expecting WNW quality will be disappointed. It'll be good, but not that good.

 

Not sure how you know this, but, I would simply say that all photos of the sprues and CAD images suggest just the opposite.  So do the 1/48 scale kits that are already out that portray very high quality moldings and parts.  I will be surprised if this kit does not rival what we have seem from a great many WNW kits so far.

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The Dolphin and Great Ack kits are incredible bits of plastic.  Haven't seen the Caudron in the flesh, but I'm sure it's the same way.  The Nieuport should be the same top quality

 

 

 

 

Matt 

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41 minutes ago, esarmstrong said:

 

Not sure how you know this, but, I would simply say that all photos of the sprues and CAD images suggest just the opposite.  So do the 1/48 scale kits that are already out that portray very high quality moldings and parts.  I will be surprised if this kit does not rival what we have seem from a great many WNW kits so far.

I don't know it. 

 

But I surmise. Wingnut Wings have pretty much unlimited resources at hand. They have the best research, the best CAD, the best computer power, the best moulders, the best decal printers, best instruction printers, best box artist and have no need to work to a particular budget and timeframe - they just use all those resources, and all the time they need, and work until they get it absolutely correct.

 

CSM just don't have the resources or experience to knock a 1/32 WNW quality model off the bat at their first attempt. WNW is the ultimate against which to be measured. Only Tamiya manage it, as far as I'm concerned.

 

If CSM manage to produce a WNW quality kit - and undercut them on price - I'll be pleasantly surprised, as I've got both versions on pre-order at Hannants.

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Sorry but what you wrote is not a realistic assessment but more the repetition of a religious mantra! No, WnW kits are not perfect. They are exceptional but not perfect. The Albatros is a good example. They released probably the best kit ever of the plane but there are  multiple tweaks to correct shortcuts or small errors. Similarly, compare their lozange decals with Aviattic ones and give me your feeling about their decals. Do not get me wrong. I love their kits and what they did or do for large scale models. However, I will always analyze a kit as a single product, whoever has released it and I will never purchase something just because it has been released by X and automatically deduce it will be obviously better than what will be released by Y. This is marketing or faith, not critical sense! Wait for the CSM kit to be able to compare... 

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Maybe people will change their perceptions? Have to admit WNW do a nice job with instructions and research. The exchange rate etc. though makes them expensive, but I expect profit is not their main motive. Good luck to CS hope they make a nice kit with more to come in the future...

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2 hours ago, thierry laurent said:

The Albatros is a good example. They released probably the best kit ever of the plane but there are  multiple tweaks to correct shortcuts or small errors. Similarly, compare their lozange decals with Aviattic ones and give me your feeling about their decals.

True I prefer aviattic but WNW is improving fast with fitted decals in better register. The wood decals for the Albatros b2 look great. 

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Keep in mind WnW subcontracts most of the activities to create the kits. They pushed that model probably further than any plane model company before them. 

 

However, tell me what prevents another company to do the same and possibly with the same sub-contractors...? 

 

Money? Well, this is just an investor decision that is not limited to the enthusiasm of Peter Jackson, hopefully! 

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9 minutes ago, thierry laurent said:

Keep in mind WnW subcontracts most of the activities to create the kits. They pushed that model probably further than any plane model company before them. 

 

However, tell me what prevents another company to do the same and possibly with the same sub-contractors...? 

 

Money? Well, this is just an investor decision that is not limited to the enthusiasm of Peter Jackson, hopefully! 

Interesting...so only the R&D and decision making is done in-house and the manufacturing O.S. 

Hope CS sell plenty and make enough to reinvest in new kits.

...and we get a review soon. The proof will be in the pudding as they say...

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12 hours ago, thierry laurent said:

Sorry but what you wrote is not a realistic assessment but more the repetition of a religious mantra! No, WnW kits are not perfect. They are exceptional but not perfect. The Albatros is a good example. They released probably the best kit ever of the plane but there are  multiple tweaks to correct shortcuts or small errors. Similarly, compare their lozange decals with Aviattic ones and give me your feeling about their decals. Do not get me wrong. I love their kits and what they did or do for large scale models. However, I will always analyze a kit as a single product, whoever has released it and I will never purchase something just because it has been released by X and automatically deduce it will be obviously better than what will be released by Y. This is marketing or faith, not critical sense! Wait for the CSM kit to be able to compare... 

It's really not a "religious mantra", but a measured and detailed evaluation of the 60+ boxing's that WNW have released. Of course, no kit is perfect, and never will be, but the WNW kits are just an absolute joy to construct. They fit. Every time. They look superb. The instructions are unparallelled (although CSM are blatantly copying them!). Yes, I agree that the Aviattic lozenge decals are superior, but they cost an extra £20 - $26 or so, which turns a $79 kit into a $105 kit. Most are happy with the kit decals.

 

The Albie was a 2010 mould, one of their earlier releases, and although not without issues, it can be built OOB and still lack any egregious faults. 

 

My faith in WNW has nothing to do with "marketing or faith". WNW do very, very little marketing. They just build kits and release them, with the odd kit sent to reviewers as "marketing". I rate them because they've never issued a "bad" kit. When you've got a track record of 60 odds kits - each of which is generally agreed to be the best of its type in any scale - it's really quite logical, reasonable and balanced to expect their next kit, whatever it may be, to also hit the same benchmark.

 

Every WNW I've built has been thoroughly enjoyable. The quality has increased as they've gained experience - the moulding of the wings on the Taube is stunning, and the D.I corrugated effect and wing option are superb.

 

Yes, having the actual CSM kit is far better than educated guesswork, but as this is a discussion board for 1/32 aeroplanes, a pre-release critique is not unreasonable.

 

Again, I hope I'm proved wrong and the CSM kits are WNW quality.

 

 

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One interesting feature of the released photo of the sprues for this model is the fact that the fuselage side, top and bottom pieces as well as the front section are all separate parts. This allows significant room for release of many more of the Nieuport family. Hopefully this will happen as the detail parts look infinitely better than the Hobbycraft alternative and likely better than the Roden versions, even from the 3 to 6 foot view we get in the released photos. And I still want some Polish, Estonian, Don Republic,  and IRAS (Czarist) decal options...especially Ilya Murometz, Mermaids, Horses and that lady with the sword. (Sorry if my phobia of all things red star still cripples my model building, even if that Mig 23 is a real thing of beauty).

 

I need to print or mask some of those, I guess.

 

Tnarg

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If there's one aeroplane that can do with multiple boxing's, it's the Nieuport range.

 

The 17bis, 21 & 23 should be able to be produced with fairly limited changes, but the 11, 16, 24 & 27 will need more substantial changes?

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Hi Dean,

 

I fully understand your view on WnW kits and globally shares it. What I did not agree with was the automatic conclusion that the CSM kit will obviously reach a lower level of quality.

 

Keep in mind the Nieuport is their first large scale kit but not their first kit as they have already released various exquisite 1/48 and 1/35 kits.

 

So, as you, I hope that the kit will be up to our expectations. Wait and see.

 

BR

 

Thierry

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