Paint... things have changed, please advise!

[Viper_Crewdawg]

I am returning to the hobby after a 22 year hiatus.  Actually, my airbrush had a conflict of interest and we parted ways, but she has returned... the airbrush, that is.  She said I used and abused her, made her do all the work.

 

When I was building, 99% of everything I built was painted in Polly S acrylics with some oil washes, Future, and Alcad where needed.  Never painted with Model Masters and other paints, as I didn't have good luck with them.  Back then, Vallejo was just a start-up.  Mr. Color was used by some but was hard to get.  Tamiya is Tamiya, but color matching to RAL and FS #'s darn near impossible.  Great paint, tho',

 

Well, fast-forward to today.  Testors bought Polly S and Polly Scale, and then I hear that they folded.  Needless to say, Polly S is no more.  Shame, that.

 

Now, we have Tamiya still, and still doesn't really match anything.  Mr. Color, Vallejo, and a new kid on the block, Mission Models.

 

Paint has gotten 'spensive!  Wow - $$$

 

I've read comments across the web - "Mr Color is the greatest!"  "No, you idiot, Vallejo is the cat's meow!"  "Fuggeddaboudit, use MM and you'll never use anything else."
 

I'm so confused.

 

Without the hyperbole, please advise - Mr Color, Vallejo, or Mission Models?  What'cha think?  I need to know where I should focus my $.

 

Thanks in advance!

 

Kev

 

BTW, I just discovered this might be in the wrong forum...

Edited April 10, 2022 by Viper_Crewdawg

[LSP_Kevin]

10 minutes ago, Viper_Crewdawg said:

BTW, I just discovered this might be in the wrong forum...

 

And I've just moved it for you!

 

The landscape for model and hobby paints has never been so diverse, and so confusing. Hardly anyone seems to use enamels any more, and synthetic lacquers are the current vogue. Alcohol-based acrylics like Gunze and Tamiya are also popular, as are the growing ranges of water-soluble paints from the likes of Vallejo, Mig, and AK Interactive. There's also Lifecolor, but that stuff's harder to work with than a toddler.

 

Most of us tend to take a horses-for-courses approach, and just use whatever's best suited to the job at hand. The synthetic lacquers (SMS, MRP, Mr. Color, etc) are excellent for airbrushing, and generally outperform the other types. Gunze and Tamiya are good workhorses, but don't tend to hand-brush very well (though it's doable with the right approach). The water-soluble paints are excellent for hand-brushing (though not as good as old-school lead-containing enamels), but give variable results with an airbrush. Lifecolor sucks at everything.

 

As usual, YMMV.

 

Kev

 

 

[Greif8]

Welcome to the forums Kev!  As out LSP Kev points out there are many choices available to the modeller when it comes to paints.  Kev made some very "on point" observations and had gave some excellent advice.  Below are some of my thoughts and experiences.

 

Airbrushing:  I use mostly MRP and Tamiya Acrylics for airbrushing, with some Alclad II and Mr. Hobby metallics for airbrushing parts that need a metal look.  All the paints perform well in the airbrushes - I use H&S Infinity and Evolution using .15mm, .20mm and .40mm nozzles, as well as a Grex Tritium TG3 using .5mm and .7mm nozzles.  As all the above have strong fumes a good airbrush paint booth to evacuate the fumes is a very good idea as the fumes can smell up several rooms, and of course the are not healthy.  MRP and Alcad II are pre-thinned, and I spray them "as is"; I thin the others 50:50 with Mr. Color or Tamiya Lacquer thinner, or Mr. Color Leveling Thinner (Lacquer) for most jobs.  I have been able to airbrush Lifecolor paints with good results but they take a lot of effort to get a good spray finish.  Like all water based acrylics things like tip drying while spraying can be a challenge.  

 

Two lines of paint that I had either little luck airbrushing or had other issues were:  Vallejo and Vallejo Model Air and Mission Model.  I never got comfortable mixing, thinning and spraying the Vallejo line; but that is on me - Vallejo has many adherents and many people get outstanding airbrush results with them.  My problem with Mission Model paints was not airbrushing it.  It was easy to thin, mixed well and I got good results airbrushing it.  However, I had both their thinner and polyurethane additive go bad on me, the poly additive twice.  When I asked the owner of the paints I was told I had stored it incorrectly - he was wrong about that - and recommended that I pay closer attention to instructions.  He then recommended that I store the Poly additive in the fridge.  I decided to opt out of Mission Model paints at that point.  To be fair, like Vallejo, many people get great results with Mission Model paint and again, I did think when thinned correctly, and with the poly additive, it did spray well.

 

Brush Painting:  I have used Lifecolor paints for brush painting for many years, and have always had good results with the line.  I have been able to use Tamiya and Mr. Hobby metallics for spot touch ups; but they are not really suitable for brush painting, in my case at least.  I also use artist oils, either Winsor and Newton or Abteilung 501, for painting faces and other flesh areas, as well as for some weathering purposes.  I have seen many people get excellent brush painting results with the Vallejo line as well.  As you can see Kev and I have different views on the Lifecolor line!  And his advice that YMMV is good advice for all brands of paint, as each of us tend to work a bit differently, which makes for a very rich collective experience.

 

HTH,

Ernest

 

  

[mozart]

Try MRP, sprays ready from the bottle, dries quickly, great colour matching and an extensive range.....what's not to like?

[MikeC]

I've tried several brands of acrylics, and got a bit fed up trying to remember different characteristics,  what to thin with,  etc. So a year or several ago I decided to standardise on Tamiya and Mr Hobby Aqueous.  They're good for what I want to do,  they can be intermixed, and I'm used to them. I'm not so bothered about exact colour matches, close enough is good enough.  

Edited April 10, 2022 by MikeC

[Viper_Crewdawg]

12 hours ago, LSP_Kevin said:

... There's also Lifecolor, but that stuff's harder to work with than a toddler.  ... Lifecolor sucks at everything.

 Well, in summary, Lifecolor is definitely out!  I haven't see that on the shelf anywhere.  Is that the Revell paint in a cube?

 

Thanks, Kev.

 

Kev

[Viper_Crewdawg]

Thanks for the input, guys.

 

Checking around, Lifecolor doesn't really exist locally here in OH.  Seems to be a UK and Europe paint.

 

I won't spray with lacquers any longer, as I think it has ill effects on the household cats.  And where the model bench is, no options to vent outside.

 

I read the MM manual for using their paints, and the local shops also say great things about it, but "you must prime first", and all shops here recommend Tamiya fine primer in the spray bomb.

 

I think I'll run a limited trial of some of these products and see how they perform to determine my "mileage, so to speak.

 

Kev

[Woody V]

On 4/10/2022 at 2:55 AM, Greif8 said:

My problem with Mission Model paints was not airbrushing it.  It was easy to thin, mixed well and I got good results airbrushing it.  However, I had both their thinner and polyurethane additive go bad on me, the poly additive twice.  When I asked the owner of the paints I was told I had stored it incorrectly - he was wrong about that - and recommended that I pay closer attention to instructions.  He then recommended that I store the Poly additive in the fridge.  I decided to opt out of Mission Model paints at that point.  To be fair, like Vallejo, many people get great results with Mission Model paint and again, I did think when thinned correctly, and with the poly additive, it did spray well.

 

I had similar problems including the fact that some colors remain water soluble long after they dry.... and I got the same "it's your fault" stonewalling when I complained. The instructions are so nebulous "add 2 to 10 drops, but not too much" (paraphrasing) I'm like what? No thanks, I just want to paint my model, not engage in some chemistry experiment.

Edited April 11, 2022 by Archer Fine Transfers

[Greif8]

14 hours ago, Viper_Crewdawg said:

Thanks for the input, guys.

 

Checking around, Lifecolor doesn't really exist locally here in OH.  Seems to be a UK and Europe paint.

 

I won't spray with lacquers any longer, as I think it has ill effects on the household cats.  And where the model bench is, no options to vent outside.

 

I read the MM manual for using their paints, and the local shops also say great things about it, but "you must prime first", and all shops here recommend Tamiya fine primer in the spray bomb.

 

I think I'll run a limited trial of some of these products and see how they perform to determine my "mileage, so to speak.

 

Kev

 

 

Hi Kev, if you follow the Mission Model instructions, use their thinner only, and; as you have pointed out, prime first the results are quite good.  You got some good advice about using Tamiya primer, it is excellent; however it does stink up the place.  An alternative that does not smell nearly as strong is Badger Stynylrez primer.  It is also an excellent primer with strong adherence to the platic once it cures (pretty quickly, but not a fast a Tamiya primer).  However, you have to spray it at 20-30 psi using a .5mm nozzle or larger to airbrush it well and avoid tip drying/clogging issues.  Cleaning the airbrush is a bit more work than using Tamiya primer, or any other laqcuer based primer.  Like nearly everything else having to do with airbrush paints there are trade offs.

 

HTH,

Ernest 

[Greif8]

9 hours ago, Archer Fine Transfers said:

 

I had similar problems including the fact that some colors remain water soluble long after they dry.... and I got the same "it's your fault" stonewalling when I complained. The instructions are so nebulous "add 2 to 10 drops, but not too much" (paraphrasing) I'm like what? No thanks, I just want to paint my model, not engage in chemistry experiment.

 

 

I hear you Woody!  I did not care for the owner's attitude when I asked some questions.  And though (IMHO) Mission Models is very good airbrushing paint, I can get the same results using MRP with less than 1/3 the prep time and effort.  I only live about 7 hours away from where MRP is produced and can buy it direct from them, or from one of many German online stores that sell it.  That makes it a no brainer for me.

 

Ernest 

[coogrfan]

On 4/10/2022 at 9:31 AM, mozart said:

Try MRP, sprays ready from the bottle, dries quickly, great colour matching and an extensive range.....what's not to like?

 MRP also has a acrylic line that is ideal for brushing details and/or touch ups of their lacquer based airbrush paints. The beauty of this is that the colors match perfectly between paint types. 

Edited April 11, 2022 by coogrfan

[Woody V]

4 hours ago, coogrfan said:

MRP also has a acrylic line that is ideal for brushing

 

Same with Mr. Color, but I've not used them so I can't comment on the brushing. 

[chrish]

My .02 cents would be to agree with everything already said….maybe pointless for me to add anything in that case but oh well.

I’ve had great success with Tamiya acrylics (and lacquers) as well as Gunner Aqueous and decent success with Vallejo model air. Not so much with (when it was available, Testors acrylics (finally threw away all the bottles after the final disaster) I must admit to having the same experience with Mission Models paints and the same response from the customer care person, (all my fault)

I have to thin the Vallejo model air paint to get it through my airbrush, I think it’s designed to be sprayed through the airbrush “as is”

off my soap box and back to work 
 

[Woody V]

Surprised no one has suggested Ammo by Mig. All they sell is water based acrylics and they have sets for aircraft as well as individual bottles.

Highly recommended.

[LSP_Kevin]

55 minutes ago, Archer Fine Transfers said:

Surprised no one has suggested Ammo by Mig. All they sell is water based acrylics and they have sets for aircraft as well as individual bottles.

Highly recommended.

 

In my mind, they're lumped in with Vallejo and AK Interactive, in that all 3 are very similar (if not identical) paints.

 

Kev