HB B24 discussion: AM and fixes

[tomprobert]

14 hours ago, zeusbheld said:

i've seen on many threads where the "be grateful there's a 1/32 Lib at all" crowd have correctly pointed out that the alternative to Hobby Boss is vacu-formed. Tigger Models appears to still be around. anyone know anything about this kit? how's the wing cross section, is it accurate? 

the wing cross-section is the last thing between me and a big Lib. a hybrid of vac form wings and HB everything else might be one thing to try, if the wing cross section is better... i may give that a go. 

Both the Tigger and Combat vacs have the correct aerofoil shape for the wing.

You could, theoretically, use the vac wing and detail parts from the HB kit. However, you’d spend an awful lot of time scribing and riveting to get the surface detail to match the HB parts as the vacs come completely devoid of all surface detail - a blank canvass as it were. Also, you’d need to make substantial spars to support both the wings themselves and the weight of the model. In short, it could be done but is an awful lot of work…

[thierry laurent]

I think Tom is fully right. It will take far less work to correct oneself the Hobbyboss wings rather than work from very basic vac parts. Iain's effort clearly showed the plastic parts are souple enough to support the correction. Obviously it would be far easier with a 3d printed corrected spar part but it should be possible to get a similar result with plasticard and a lot of elbow grease for the ones who cannot wait. Far from easy but not impossible.

[Pup7309]

That’s a lot of surgery. The new HB 1/48 Lib has correct wing shape, not much help If your set on 1/32, but just an option…

[zeusbheld]

7 hours ago, Pup7309 said:

That’s a lot of surgery. The new HB 1/48 Lib has correct wing shape, not much help If your set on 1/32, but just an option…

it's good they raised their game, but not much good for me personally, i don't 1/48. hopefully they redid the turrets as one-piece parts too. 

 

23 hours ago, thierry laurent said:

I think Tom is fully right. It will take far less work to correct oneself the Hobbyboss wings rather than work from very basic vac parts. Iain's effort clearly showed the plastic parts are souple enough to support the correction. Obviously it would be far easier with a 3d printed corrected spar part but it should be possible to get a similar result with plasticard and a lot of elbow grease for the ones who cannot wait. Far from easy but not impossible.

Iain, conceptually, has the solution i believe. it is possible, i think, to do as you say and make the spar part from another material, with plastic probably being the best option. 

HOWEVER, my plans need to account for my capacity to do stupid. i might totally screw the wings up and need a plan B. the most obvious plan B is another Lib kit, rather than a vac-form, but it's possible that i will be stumped applying the solution so i'd like to have a plan B tucked away in my mind

 

On 2/25/2024 at 1:35 AM, tomprobert said:

You could, theoretically, use the vac wing and detail parts from the HB kit. However, you’d spend an awful lot of time scribing and riveting to get the surface detail to match the HB parts

 

i think this'd be good enough for a plan B (C actually, plan A is hope Iain makes his solution available, plan B is I follow his solution and try to execute it myself). if i screw up the kit wings i may pivot this way, scribing isn't THAT difficult, just tedious. i might consider making myself an RC foamie from it, i think a vac would be a good template. except that my experience with RC so far suggests i should stick to tanks and boats, and be extra careful about boats (however my nature is "that will probably end badly! ima try it!"). 

[zeusbheld]

On 2/24/2024 at 10:09 PM, Danjo said:

Another highly recommended book would be Alan Griffiths:

 

https://www.amazon.com/Consolidated-Mess-Illustrated-Nose-turreted-Production/dp/8361421165

 

Regards the wing you might consider the old Guillow's kit that is built up from balsa ribs/spars. It scales at 1/28 but could serve as a pattern for a new wing to 1/32. Good luck! In a perfect world we would have dedicated versions of not only the B-24 but also PB4Y, C-87 etc.

 

 

the price of the actual physical book is eye watering; but Casemate offer a digital edition on their site. it's not ideal, as you have to use their vendor's site to read the book, but the asking price for 'collectible' copies is too high. 

it'll be immensely useful for my 1/72 Libs though (9 Yanks and a Jerk, an H, and CBI ship Georgia Peach, a J). 

yeah Masters of the Air finally drops and so i go a bit crazy with reading/listening about heavy bombers... and from a series about B-17s (which i won't even watch until the last episode drops) i end up... obsessed with Libs. 

[Iain]

Using the wings from either of the vac kits is a lot more work than correcting the kit supplied wings IMHO.

 

I have a couple of the ID Models (Tigger) kits - somewhere...

 

I'm so close with a solution - the really hard work is done - but it's at least a few months away I'm afraid - and I make no promises as I'll feel even more guilty if it doesn't materialise.   

 

Iain

 

 

[blackbetty]

i know there are vthe vector engines to correct the very basic kit ones, but i cant seem to find them (not doing facebook)

are there other options? i found a boatload of engines on scalemates, but which are the correct p&w

[zeusbheld]

2 hours ago, blackbetty said:

i know there are vthe vector engines to correct the very basic kit ones, but i cant seem to find them (not doing facebook)

are there other options? i found a boatload of engines on scalemates, but which are the correct p&w

if you want the Vector engines, i got mine here: https://www.neomega-resin.com/132nd-b-24-engine-set-1068-p.asp

[Pup7309]

23 hours ago, zeusbheld said:

it's good they raised their game, but not much good for me personally, i don't 1/48. hopefully they redid the turrets as one-piece parts too. 

 

HOWEVER, my plans need to account for my capacity to do stupid. i might totally screw the wings up and need a plan B

Haha no the turrets are still split with basic engines. But there is more chance of aftermarket with this one.

 

PLAN D: just try to accept it for what it is - flawed but ok

[zeusbheld]

2 hours ago, Pup7309 said:

PLAN D: just try to accept it for what it is - flawed but ok

there is no plan D. i will fix the wing cross section, or ruin the kit trying. the shape where wing intersects fuselage is REALLY noticeable in photos of real Libs, i don't want to have to look at the out-of-the-box wing. if i succeed, then i have a fix for every major issue, unless i missed something. 

[TimW]

On 2/23/2024 at 10:55 PM, zeusbheld said:

my first wave of goodies have arrived. the Cold War Studios turret is gorgeous. so much so that there's a slight chance I'll build a J just so i can use two (haven't bought the kit yet, wanted to make sure solutions to the things that bother me could be obtained). 

the Vector Resin engines and cowlings--also gorgeous. there are many plausible options for engines in 1/32, but enough people have cast doubt on the shape of the kit cowlings that i went this way. 

Aerocraft landing gear parts are also gorgeous and incredibly sturdy. i got a bunch of their stuff, inlcuding legs for an OV-10 and O-2, and their resin parts for the Airfix Avro Vulcan. all their stuff is top quality. the studiness of the gear is important for a lib this big, as I'll be using tungsten putty (1.7 times denser than lead) to weigh the nose down and keep the bird from perching on its tail feathers. 

still waiting for the books, ordered Log of the Liberators by Steve Birdsall and The B-24 Liberator: A Pictorial History by Allan G Blue. anyone know of anymore must-have Liberator books? I have several 1/72 Libs in the queue also, going a bit B-24 crazy. I also ordered Nine Yanks and a Jerk, a book about one particular B-24H that Jimmy Stewart flew. I already have the Iliad 1/72 decals for this ship, and Airfix has conveniently decided to drop a 1/72 B-24H so I don't have to convert little windows or anything. 

Agree about the CW turret!  It is excellent.  Still not sure how to handle the improvised ball turret that 5th AF Birds had.  May just wimp out and go with the ball turret for my sanity's sake.

 

We'll see.

 

Tim W.

[zeusbheld]

14 hours ago, TimW said:

Agree about the CW turret!  It is excellent.  Still not sure how to handle the improvised ball turret that 5th AF Birds had.  May just wimp out and go with the ball turret for my sanity's sake.

 

We'll see.

 

Tim W.

the improvised ball turret would have had to have been retracted when the plane is parked, wouldn't it? i'd imagine dragging it on the ground would create... maintenance issues. 

also, any 5th AF references you can recommend? 90th BG in particular but also 5th in general. 

i'm most likely going to build a D, "Moby Dick" of 90th. plan B is a Ploesti ship but i'm about 70 percent leaning toward 90th. i haven't bought the actual kit yet as there's still a 10 percent chance i'll change my mind and do a J LOL

Edited February 29 by zeusbheld

[kalashnikov-47]

On 2/27/2024 at 8:06 AM, zeusbheld said:

there is no plan D. i will fix the wing cross section, or ruin the kit trying. the shape where wing intersects fuselage is REALLY noticeable in photos of real Libs, i don't want to have to look at the out-of-the-box wing. if i succeed, then i have a fix for every major issue, unless i missed something. 

My opinion is the same as yours.  If you pull that off please document it. 

[zeusbheld]

3 hours ago, kalashnikov-47 said:

My opinion is the same as yours.  If you pull that off please document it. 

odds are very good that if i pull that off, Iain will have done so already LOL

[TimW]

12 hours ago, zeusbheld said:

the improvised ball turret would have had to have been retracted when the plane is parked, wouldn't it? i'd imagine dragging it on the ground would create... maintenance issues. 

also, any 5th AF references you can recommend? 90th BG in particular but also 5th in general. 

i'm most likely going to build a D, "Moby Dick" of 90th. plan B is a Ploesti ship but i'm about 70 percent leaning toward 90th. i haven't bought the actual kit yet as there's still a 10 percent chance i'll change my mind and do a J LOL

I don't think they had to retract it--the "dish" seems to have been almost flush with the bottom of the fuselage and there was 1 or 2 .50 cals mounted there.  Not sure how useful it was as a gun position.

 

I'll let you know what I find out, if anything.

 

Cheers,

 

Tim W.