Guest Airfixer Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 That'll be a tough challenge, Derek. And most definitely a treat to watch. (Taking my Pickelhaube off to you...) Cheers Erik Derek B 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Menelaos Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 (edited) Derek I have a very nice book (greek) about the F1. http://www.largescaleplanes.com/reviews/review.php?rid=276 (Please PM me) The Atar 09K50 came from the older 09B and 09C from the M III and M 5 It did performed well and had differences but it was proven not efficient enough for the F1 That was obious when the F1 took the M53 and even the Tumanski RD-33!! Edited January 19, 2017 by Menelaos Derek B 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek B Posted January 19, 2017 Author Share Posted January 19, 2017 Derek I have a very nice book (greek) about the F1. http://www.largescaleplanes.com/reviews/review.php?rid=276 (Please PM me) The Atar 09K50 came from the older 09B and 09C from the M III and M 5 It did performed well and had differences but it was proven not efficient enough for the F1 That was obious when the F1 took the M53 and even the Tumanski RD-33!! That book looks amazing Menelaos - I will PM you. Derek Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Airfixer Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 (edited) I see a chance you may be able to use sections from the forward and fwd intermediate fuselage... Still needing LOTS of love and affection, though. By approximation: Edited January 19, 2017 by Airfixer Menelaos 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek B Posted January 19, 2017 Author Share Posted January 19, 2017 OK, some prliminary dimension calcs from the full size aircraft, scaled to 1/32: Mirage F 1CG Overall length (1/32): 478.125mm Wingspan (1/32): 262.5mm (131.125mm 1/2 span) Height (1/32): 140.625mm Similar (1/32) sizes for the Mirage IIIE are as follows: OAL: 469.503mm W/S: 256.875mm (128.437mm 1/2 span) H: 140.625mm So, the Mirage F 1CG is not much larger than the Mirage IIIE, but of course is proprtionally very different indeed. Once I have the opportunity to enlarge some drawings and carry out some tracings, I will then have a very clear idea of what I can or cannot do with the Mirage IIIE kit. Derek Menelaos 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jenshb Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 I seem to remember one of the French members here on LSP was scratchbuilding a Mirage F.1 in 1:32, but the project stalled. He made quite good progress on the fuselage IIRC. Tried to find that thread again, but came up with nothing. Would love to see some progress on that. To my eyes, the windshield of the F.1 appears longer and narrower than the III and 5, so the only part you may be able to use would be the canopy, and I wouldn't be surprised if that too was different. Given the age of the kit, I would think the exhaust is so poor that you'd be better off replacing that or scratchbuilding it. I suppose the nosecone, air intakes and tailfin can all be a useful basis to work from. Jens Menelaos and Derek B 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek B Posted January 19, 2017 Author Share Posted January 19, 2017 I see a chance you may be able to use sections from the forward and fwd intermediate fuselage... Still needing LOTS of love and affection, though. By approximation: Thanks Airfixer - I posted my dimensions post before I saw your post (I wish I had your software to do this - old school pencil and paper for me!) I suspected (and hoped) that I could use the cockpit, so thank you for your work here confirming this. I also think that I can also probably use the rear fuselage and intakes as well (albeit with quite a bit of modification and tweaking). Cheers Derek Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Airfixer Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 (edited) The intake sits further aft, has a larger diameter and the upper edges of the splitter has rounded corners. Fuselage cuts aka cross sections: The intermediate and rear fuselage of the Mirage F-1 is a totally different beast and bears very little resemblance to those of the Mirage III series. On the Mirage III series, omitting the wingroots, etc, the cross sections a more or less circular or oval. On the F-1, pretty much everything from frame 17 to frame 39 (looking aft) looks like a rectangle or trapeze with rounded corners - roughly speaking. In the bottom view, the F-1 depicts a more heavily pronounced "coke bottle" waist line than the Mirage III. HTH Erik Edited January 19, 2017 by Airfixer Menelaos 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek B Posted January 19, 2017 Author Share Posted January 19, 2017 The intake sits further aft, has a larger diameter and the upper edges of the splitter has rounded corners. Fuselage cuts aka cross sections: The intermediate and rear fuselage of the Mirage F-1 is a totally different beast and bears very little resemblance to those of the Mirage III series. On the Mirage III series, omitting the wingroots, etc, the cross sections a more or less circular or oval. On the F-1, pretty much everything from frame 17 to frame 39 (looking aft) looks like a rectangle or trapeze with rounded corners - roughly speaking. In the bottom view, the F-1 depicts a more heavily pronounced "coke bottle" waist line than the Mirage III. HTH Erik Hi Erik, Excellent - thank you. Once I have managed to photocopy some drawings to the correct scale, I can see what I am up against. At this stage, I am looking at a complete scratch build of the aircraft (which from experience, is much quicker than attempting to modify kit parts in most cases). It would have been nice if I could have found a donor kit with enough detail parts of the correct type to help me (wheels, engine face/exhaust parts, cockpit parts, etc). Cheers Derek Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Airfixer Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 I perfectly agree... You'll be much better off by building them from scratch. Cheers Erik Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek B Posted January 19, 2017 Author Share Posted January 19, 2017 I perfectly agree... You'll be much better off by building them from scratch. Cheers Erik Derek Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jenshb Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 Regarding wheels...I wonder if you can use 1:48 Mirage 2000 wheels as a starting point at least for the mains? Jens Derek B 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek B Posted January 19, 2017 Author Share Posted January 19, 2017 One of the reasons that the Mirage F 1CG has piqued my interest is because of this: (and Ioannis Lekkas forthcoming 'Mirage 2000 under the skin' book). Following in Loic's footsteps is not a bad idea: http://forum.largescaleplanes.com/index.php?showtopic=55372&page=1 Derek Menelaos 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek B Posted January 19, 2017 Author Share Posted January 19, 2017 Regarding wheels...I wonder if you can use 1:48 Mirage 2000 wheels as a starting point at least for the mains? Jens Good point Jens Derek Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek B Posted January 19, 2017 Author Share Posted January 19, 2017 (edited) I perfectly agree... You'll be much better off by building them from scratch. Cheers Erik Glad you like Phantoms Erik - I am a Phantom phan also Derek Edited January 19, 2017 by Derek B Menelaos 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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