Jump to content


Photo

Kittyhawk 1/35 Seahawk!


  • Please log in to reply
65 replies to this topic

#31 Clunkmeister

Clunkmeister

    Senior Member

  • LSP_Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 12,069 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Анна, Тексас, Сједињене Америчке Државе

Posted 17 February 2018 - 08:53 PM

Floyd is Army and KH has never released an OH-58. I'll refrain from commenting on another slightly incorrect sentence in there as the written sarcasm, friendly rib poking won't be taken as it's intended. :) :)


Apologies. Any Army guy called a Marine should get puffed up a bit. I sure do. LOL

They released a Little Bird AH-6J, my mistake.

I actually see great improvement with KH. Now, the P-39 was an unfortunate train wreck. What happened, who knows, the T-6 was OK, a few basic issues with shape, but nothing serious other than the aircraft that was measured was an air show performer that had been crashed and rebuilt from rubble who knows how many times.
The T-28 is a real dream to me.

Here's what I think is happening. You gave two teams. The American Team, and the Chinese Team.

American Team is made up of designers, researchers, and experts. All are modelers and aviation fanatics.

Chinese Team is King. They're the production team. The money's there. They have final veto power, so some dumb stuff gets injected into the mix. Stupid production decisions along the lines of breaking a 48 scale fuselage into six sections for no reason whatsoever. And ejector pin towers in the oddest of spots, although they've gotten better.

But here's the rub. I build model flying machines. Out of resin and plastic. I don't assemble erector sets, I build models. That in itself involves some problem solving. I expect it. Maybe I should expect more? But I find KH kits accurate in shape with exquisite exterior detail. I can build on that.

Take a look at the new Chinese Air Force Su-35 in 1/48. They've jumped to the big league with that one.
Was mich nicht umbringt macht mich stärker

#32 Dave Roof

Dave Roof

    Senior Member

  • LSP_Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 599 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Pomona, CA - living in Marietta, GA

Posted 17 February 2018 - 08:59 PM

Apologies. Any Army guy called a Marine should get puffed up a bit. I sure do. LOL

 

Well, when you consider the fact that ARMY is an acronym for "Ain't Really a Marine Yet", they should get a bit puffed up! :D :D


  • alaninaustria, Jack, Erick Swanberg and 1 other like this

#33 Maxim

Maxim

    Senior Member

  • LSP_Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,141 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Victoria, Australia

Posted 17 February 2018 - 09:42 PM

I am proofing the CAD for the Seahawks now along with about five other people.  I take the suggestions that their research is bad or flawed.  I take a lot of time and employ a lot of subject matter experts on these helicopter kits.  Army guys are helping with the Army stuff.  Air Force guys with the Air Force and Navy guys on the Seahawks.  We are doing our best to find and correct any errors we see on the CAD.  If you have an issue with the research phase of the Hawks, blame me.  I am the point of contact for Kitty Hawk when it comes to helicopters.  Any inaccuracies, I take full responsibility for.  They draw it, we correct it until its released.  Do we catch everything?  No but we certainly do try.  Me and my team take this job very seriously as we want the most accurate helicopter kits on the market period. 

 

I'd say Kitty Hawk's helicopters are some of the best on the market.  Each one is getting better.  You may not agree but they are the most accurate ones on the market right now. 

Floyd

Floyd, thanks for your insight into KH. Perhaps you can suggest a Seaking to them when you speak with them. Many 32 scale modellers want one.



#34 John Irwin

John Irwin

    Hooked For Life

  • LSP_Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 231 posts

Posted 17 February 2018 - 10:01 PM

Here's what I think is happening. You gave two teams. The American Team, and the Chinese Team.

American Team is made up of designers, researchers, and experts. All are modelers and aviation fanatics.

Chinese Team is King. They're the production team. The money's there. They have final veto power, so some dumb stuff gets injected into the mix. Stupid production decisions along the lines of breaking a 48 scale fuselage into six sections for no reason whatsoever. And ejector pin towers in the oddest of spots, although they've gotten better.

But here's the rub. I build model flying machines. Out of resin and plastic. I don't assemble erector sets, I build models. That in itself involves some problem solving. I expect it. Maybe I should expect more? But I find KH kits accurate in shape with exquisite exterior detail. I can build on that.
 

I tend to agree.  The best research in the world won't salvage a kit if the production guys decide to cut corners.   The two latest helos KH put out have good details, as would be expected given the experts that help them.   Then the production folks decide (for whatever reason) to replace the prominent raised rivets which cover both these helos with hundreds of indented divots.   In my view, you might as well just go back to raised panel lines while you are at it.  To me, it completely ruins the surface texture on these helos.  If they can do quality work like the latest Su they put out, should be no reason they can't replicate raised rivets in 35th scale.    I really hope that they address this with the upcoming H-60 but quite honestly, I don't think they give a crap.  



#35 Erick Swanberg

Erick Swanberg

    LSP Junkie

  • LSP_Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 157 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Ft Rucker, Al

Posted 17 February 2018 - 10:06 PM

Well, when you consider the fact that ARMY is an acronym for "Ain't Really a Marine Yet", they should get a bit puffed up! :D :D

 

Really Dave you gonna start with that hahahahahahaha


  • Jack likes this

#36 Dave Roof

Dave Roof

    Senior Member

  • LSP_Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 599 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Pomona, CA - living in Marietta, GA

Posted 17 February 2018 - 10:25 PM

Really Dave you gonna start with that hahahahahahaha

 

 

Yep! Remember, it was you Army guys that always came to our camp in Afghanistan to drink and party........always wanting to hang out with the cool kids in the combat zone! :D


  • Erick Swanberg likes this

#37 Guest_Smitty44_*

Guest_Smitty44_*
  • Guests

Posted 17 February 2018 - 10:30 PM

Apologies. Any Army guy called a Marine should get puffed up a bit. I sure do. LOL

 

Sheesh, Canadian Army isn't part of the discussion, Ern

 

wg63R7R.jpg


Edited by Smitty44, 17 February 2018 - 10:35 PM.

  • Maxim likes this

#38 Dave Williams

Dave Williams

    Senior Member

  • LSP_Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,700 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 17 February 2018 - 10:44 PM

I think the reasons many manufacturers use recessed dimples instead of raised rivets are:

1. Many modelers prefer recessed detail as it’s easier to restore after sanding and filling. Fill or wipe out a recessed rivet hole, and it’s fairly easy to just drill a replacement, and finding a correct sized bit to match the remaining rivet holes is pretty easy. A bit harder to replace a raised rivet and make it look like all the others.

2. A lot of modelers like the artistic look with washes to emphasize recessed details, whether it’s realistic or not.

To be honest, I think a lot of modelers prefer recessed details, even if it’s technically inaccurate, and I think the model companies are catering to that.

Seems like we are already slagging a kit that doesn’t yet exist (hello Trumpeter!). Instead of being happy that we are getting a big scale Seahawk, people are whining about it being 1/35 scale instead of 1/32 (if it were 1/32, others would whine about it being a different size than their Academy kits), whining about the possibility of the kit not having raised rivets (although others would whine about having to replace ones lost during sanding as they do on Apache and other kits), and talking about this “Oliver” guy, who I’m not sure what his actual involvement is in this upcoming kit. You can’t make everyone happy.
  • johncrow likes this

#39 32tragic

32tragic

    LSP Junkie

  • LSP_Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 95 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Perth, Australia

Posted 17 February 2018 - 10:49 PM

excellent.jpg


Terry A


#40 Juggernut

Juggernut

    Senior Member

  • LSP_Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,627 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Pennsylvania

Posted 17 February 2018 - 11:40 PM

Hmmmm.... my limited experience with the subject airframe tells me that MOST of the rivets on the UH-60 series are universal head (aka raised) rivets and should not be dimpled into the skin of the model.  And, with my limited experience with injection molding, one would also think it would be easier to "dimple" a tiny hole in the tool rather than excavate a raised bump in the same too to render recessed rivets where they don't exist on the real critter.  Revell did it for years and years...we sanded and restored raised details the best we knew how...sometimes it worked, sometimes it didn't.


Edited by Juggernut, 17 February 2018 - 11:42 PM.

"You can always tell a pilot.... But you can't tell him much." Pat Malara Sr. (1925 - 1997) USAAC CBI, Owner/Founder, Riverside School of Aeronautics


#41 Clunkmeister

Clunkmeister

    Senior Member

  • LSP_Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 12,069 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Анна, Тексас, Сједињене Америчке Државе

Posted 17 February 2018 - 11:50 PM

Well, when you consider the fact that ARMY is an acronym for "Ain't Really a Marine Yet", they should get a bit puffed up! :D :D


I'm retired Army, yet most of my friends are retired Marines. Go figure.
  • Harold likes this
Was mich nicht umbringt macht mich stärker

#42 Clunkmeister

Clunkmeister

    Senior Member

  • LSP_Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 12,069 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Анна, Тексас, Сједињене Америчке Државе

Posted 17 February 2018 - 11:55 PM

Sheesh, Canadian Army isn't part of the discussion, Ern
 
wg63R7R.jpg


Well, the Marines came to OUR camp to learn to party and what it was like to hang with cool kids. Then they taught others what we showed them.
They sure took of our beer with them....
  • Harold likes this
Was mich nicht umbringt macht mich stärker

#43 Floyd S. Werner, Jr.

Floyd S. Werner, Jr.

    LSP Junkie

  • LSP_Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 96 posts

Posted 18 February 2018 - 12:35 AM

Then the production folks decide (for whatever reason) to replace the prominent raised rivets which cover both these helos with hundreds of indented divots.   In my view, you might as well just go back to raised panel lines while you are at it.  To me, it completely ruins the surface texture on these helos.  

I personally prefer the rivets to be recessed.  Replication not duplication.  It you have to sand a panel line you will obliterate the raised rivet detail and it is a pain in the ass to replace.  I think if you do it right the recessed rivets look great and look like raised rivets.  See pictures below.

 

1. Many modelers prefer recessed detail as it’s easier to restore after sanding and filling. Fill or wipe out a recessed rivet hole, and it’s fairly easy to just drill a replacement, and finding a correct sized bit to match the remaining rivet holes is pretty easy. A bit harder to replace a raised rivet and make it look like all the others.

2. A lot of modelers like the artistic look with washes to emphasize recessed details, whether it’s realistic or not.

To be honest, I think a lot of modelers prefer recessed details, even if it’s technically inaccurate, and I think the model companies are catering to that.  You can’t make everyone happy.

What Dave said.

 

I think they work out quite nicely.  These are all Kitty Hawk models.

Floyd

50Tqjmh.jpg

 

u3C3IXX.jpg

 

tuZqcvr.jpg

 

XTWEVYC.jpg

 

nkhXQRt.jpg

 

8qhwYa5.jpg

 

uV2k0WU.jpg


  • zerosystem, Harold, otis252 and 1 other like this

#44 Clunkmeister

Clunkmeister

    Senior Member

  • LSP_Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 12,069 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Анна, Тексас, Сједињене Америчке Државе

Posted 18 February 2018 - 12:39 AM

Floyd, do you have a source on Greyhounds nose decals for the KH slick?

Edited by Clunkmeister, 18 February 2018 - 12:40 AM.

Was mich nicht umbringt macht mich stärker

#45 Dave Roof

Dave Roof

    Senior Member

  • LSP_Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 599 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Pomona, CA - living in Marietta, GA

Posted 18 February 2018 - 12:56 AM

Seems like we are already slagging a kit that doesn’t yet exist (hello Trumpeter!). Instead of being happy that we are getting a big scale Seahawk, people are whining about it being 1/35 scale instead of 1/32 (if it were 1/32, others would whine about it being a different size than their Academy kits), whining about the possibility of the kit not having raised rivets (although others would whine about having to replace ones lost during sanding as they do on Apache and other kits), and talking about this “Oliver” guy, who I’m not sure what his actual involvement is in this upcoming kit. You can’t make everyone happy.

 

I'm not sure if I missed something or if you're referring to a separate thread about the kit, but I haven't seen anything that would appear to be 'slagging' in this particular thread. One of the main points has been the outstanding research of the subjects vs. the execution of them. Oliver was only mentioned because of Shawn's post (#8) where it was hoped KH sought his help with details. A couple of us just mentioned that he doesn't always concern himself with being technically accurate in his scratch building, therefore may not be person to go to regarding technical and/or accurate details of any particular airframe. He is an outstanding modeler and craftsman that goes under the screen name of shark64 here and on ARC.


  • LSP_Typhoonattack and Maxim like this




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users