Jump to content


Photo

Frightening Southwest incident


  • Please log in to reply
77 replies to this topic

#31 mmaben

mmaben

    Senior Member

  • LSP_Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 4,303 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Portland, Oregon

Posted 19 April 2018 - 10:19 PM

 I silently pointed out the window so as not to cause a panic.

 

That makes 'you' a HERO !!

 

 

:whistle:


  • chrish likes this

I just like airplanes

 

Mike                        Smirnoffcat    RomanianG-2

 


#32 alaninaustria

alaninaustria

    Senior Member

  • LSP_Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 6,907 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Austria (Europe)

Posted 19 April 2018 - 10:35 PM

I've seen a few engine failures in my time and as has been said the debris should be contained within the cowling with it's kevlar mats and all but that has certainly failed big time.
Another thing I used to hear was that during an emergency, one pilot used to do the flying whilst the other used to be responsible for the radio etc.
So in this case could it actually have been the first officer flying ?
Or am I behind the times...............again.
:hmmm:

Bingo - unless the Captn. did a Sully the First Officer would have been on the controls - unless absolutely necessary controls are not switched during an emergency and Pilot Flying (PF) is doing just that - flying and the Pilot Monitoring (PM) is working the radios, checklist and keeping an eye on the PF... the Cptn. is ALWAYS unless delegated for some reason in contact with the Cabin Team and Passengers... but, Southwest might have different Standard Operating Procedures (SOP)...

Edited by alaninaustria, 19 April 2018 - 10:36 PM.

  • MARU5137 likes this

#33 LSP_Ron

LSP_Ron

    Senior Member

  • LSP Moderator
  • 16,921 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Cowtown - Canada

Posted 19 April 2018 - 10:42 PM


  • MARU5137 and Gigant like this

Ron

 

 

I love deadlines. I like the whooshing sound they make as they fly by.

Douglas Adams

When I die, I'll be on time

 

 


#34 Clunkmeister

Clunkmeister

    Senior Member

  • LSP_Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 11,979 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Анна, Тексас, Сједињене Америчке Државе

Posted 19 April 2018 - 11:11 PM

I'm so in the stone ago compared to y'all.

When I flew, the right seater was often fresh out of hauling cancelled bank paper, and often had left seat time measured in the very few hundreds of hours.

 

The days of integrated cockpit management, or whatever the catch phrase is, was still in the future. The left seater was the absoluter ruler of the cockpit, like the captain of a ship, the next thing to god. 

Our right seaters were glorified checklist readers and radio guys, and if something went sideways, I had control, PERIOD. I did my time as a right seater as well, and it was a learning experience, but your learning was wholly dependent upon who you flew with and how much he was willing to show and teach you. (I was less than stellar in that regard I've been told).

 

That being said, after being made to read countless NTSB reports, the cockpit management models developed and implemented over the last few decades have, IMHO, done as much to improve commercial aviation safety as any of the great tech advances.

I'm not too proud to say now that I can see theoretical situations where my ego and knowledge of my airplane could have potentially stood in the way of good decision making....

Thank God that never happened.


  • mmaben likes this
Was mich nicht umbringt macht mich stärker

#35 Clunkmeister

Clunkmeister

    Senior Member

  • LSP_Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 11,979 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Анна, Тексас, Сједињене Америчке Државе

Posted 19 April 2018 - 11:18 PM

Looking at that video Ron just posted, the asymmetric lift must have been something else when they extended the slats.

That's an extremely lucky bunch of people on that 737. That leading edge device is beat up BAD. An uncommanded roll, on one engine, at slow speed.  Sounds like FUUUUN!!!


  • Bravo52 likes this
Was mich nicht umbringt macht mich stärker

#36 Kagemusha

Kagemusha

    Senior Member

  • LSP Moderator
  • 10,445 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Mancunia

Posted 19 April 2018 - 11:26 PM

It's deeply saddening that someone died, but it's a concern that the exact same occurrence happened to the same aircraft type with the same airline, and that the broken blade flew off in the same direction.

The relevant authorities and manufacturers need to get their fingers out, not to mention the airline.

https://arstechnica....failures/?amp=1

#37 Gigant

Gigant

    Senior Member

  • LSP_Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 784 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:South Louisiana

Posted 19 April 2018 - 11:52 PM

What the news hasn't picked up on is that this isn't the first incident of this happening with the port engine of a SouthWest 737.  It happened in 2016 as well but no injuries. Not sure if this was a blade failure or just a shroud failure?

 

 

 

According to Miles O'Brian on tonight's PBS News Hour, the 2016 incident was essentially the same cause.

 

He also said that the FAA and the NTSB wanted the airline to have all their engines' turbine fans get UT inspected but they balked at the time and got an extension.

 

Now the FAA and the NTSB is demanding Southwest do the inspections.


Edited by Gigant, 20 April 2018 - 04:12 PM.

  • MARU5137 likes this

:innocent: Tom

My photo album: https://www.flickr.c...1984@N04/albums

 


#38 RLWP

RLWP

    Senior Member

  • LSP_Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,022 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Kenilworth, UK

Posted 20 April 2018 - 08:15 AM

Looking at that video Ron just posted, the asymmetric lift must have been something else when they extended the slats.

That's an extremely lucky bunch of people on that 737. That leading edge device is beat up BAD. An uncommanded roll, on one engine, at slow speed.  Sounds like FUUUUN!!!

 

Weird things going on there. It looks like only one blade broke, yet there is damage to the cabin and the leading edge outboard of the engine. The blade couldn't go both ways

 

The NTSB report will be interesting

 

Richard


We are normal and we want our freedom!

#39 MostlyRacers

MostlyRacers

    Senior Member

  • LSP_Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 5,228 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Cornod. French Jura

Posted 20 April 2018 - 08:22 AM

The damage to the fuselage and the wing’s LE seems to come from parts of the engine shroud, from the first reports ...

Hubert
  • Bravo52 likes this

#40 RLWP

RLWP

    Senior Member

  • LSP_Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,022 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Kenilworth, UK

Posted 20 April 2018 - 08:26 AM

The damage to the fuselage and the wing’s LE seems to come from parts of the engine shroud, from the first reports ...

Hubert

 

Just interesting that the parts managed to fly outwards to such an extent on a forward moving 'plane. 

 

Perhaps a big lump of fan shroud got caught over the leading edge, then worked it's way outwards. I'm assuming the blade broke the window

 

Richard


We are normal and we want our freedom!

#41 TonyT

TonyT

    Senior Member

  • LSP_Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,132 posts

Posted 20 April 2018 - 01:34 PM

 

It's deeply saddening that someone died, but it's a concern that the exact same occurrence happened to the same aircraft type with the same airline, and that the broken blade flew off in the same direction.

The relevant authorities and manufacturers need to get their fingers out, not to mention the airline.

 

 

Sad as it may seem, it often comes down to insurance factors, if you think this as a second incident is of concern, I would google 737 rudder failures.


  • Out2gtcha likes this

#42 TonyT

TonyT

    Senior Member

  • LSP_Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,132 posts

Posted 20 April 2018 - 01:50 PM

The more interesting story is here: 

 

_100936285_046255284.jpg

 

That's the damage from a single blade failure which is supposed to be contained by the fan shroud. Not good

 

Richard

 

And in a perfect world it is

 

https://www.google.c...QEIXjAH#imgrc=_

 

Strange as it may be, I have been involved (in the cockpit) running an aircraft when the IGV's let go and took the turbine out through the jetpipe, when you are sitting in a cockpit 2 foot away from the engine gauges and you cannot read a single one because the aircraft is shaking itself to bits,  the fire alarms are blaring and flashing in your periferal  and when you tell the outside man to run, only to see he is ahead of the game, it opens ones eyes, throttle had no input and only chopping the fuel and dumping the fire bottles into it killed both the engine and the noise..... man outside thought it stopped rotating from about 90% to zero in 2 to 3 revolutions. we then had the other three to shut down normally before vacating.. Strange when looking down a detuner at the "colander" and seeing blades sticking out of 1/2 inch steel plate, then looking forward and seeing daylight through the engine.

 

The other one I had was a fighter that had been unbeknown to us throttle assisted to light and overtemped, we started it up ( actually on Bonfire night lol) I was outside man and there was an almighty surge, a flame exited the intake about 10 foot  followed by a huge bang as it ran down, indeed it was still running down as my mate passed me and he had been running it!


Edited by TonyT, 20 April 2018 - 02:22 PM.

  • Out2gtcha likes this

#43 Clunkmeister

Clunkmeister

    Senior Member

  • LSP_Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 11,979 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Анна, Тексас, Сједињене Америчке Државе

Posted 20 April 2018 - 09:31 PM

This is exactly why, (in my opinion), twin jets of any kind should not be involved on extended overwater passenger service.  That third engine on the L-1011 and DC-10 was a great insurance policy.


Was mich nicht umbringt macht mich stärker

#44 RLWP

RLWP

    Senior Member

  • LSP_Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,022 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Kenilworth, UK

Posted 20 April 2018 - 09:44 PM

As a tyro I was an apprentice with blokes who developed gas turbines in the '50s and '60s. Based on their stories it was very clear why the bullet proof glass window in the engine test cell was well in front of the first stage of the compressor

I shall never forget the first time I heard a Spey running down. Sounded like someone had dropped a bag of spanners

Happy days

Richard
  • Jack and Clunkmeister like this
We are normal and we want our freedom!

#45 LSP_Ron

LSP_Ron

    Senior Member

  • LSP Moderator
  • 16,921 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Cowtown - Canada

Posted 20 April 2018 - 10:11 PM

When they test these shrouds for blade containment it's not at 900km/hour, it's in a dyno sitting still and not in a wind tunnel from what I've been able to find on line.  In looking at a lot of the pics of both SW cases it looks to me like it blew open from air load trying to make it burst. I wonder if the blade damage makes it weak in hoop stress and airflow is really the fatal blow?  the force of airflow at 900kn/hr would be enormous.  In both cases the metal bits left on the engine are all pealed backward.

 

 

 


  • Clunkmeister likes this

Ron

 

 

I love deadlines. I like the whooshing sound they make as they fly by.

Douglas Adams

When I die, I'll be on time

 

 





0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users