Kotare teaser - it's a Bf 109K!

[CRAZY IVAN5]

44 minutes ago, Juggernut said:

Shouldn't there also be a "pipe" exiting immediately aft of the exhaust stack for the Mk108 compressed air arming exhaust?  I may be confusing it with the MG151 and if so, please disregard.

I believe you're right, good eye! I'll have to see those "raised " panel lines in person to decide if I like them as is or if some "ironmongery" is required . 

[Mark Robson]

UPDATE

 

I just reviewed a 49 page (approx) document detailing about 60 changes to be made to the mould after the first test shot.

 

The document is largely created by Darren Mildenhall with major input from Richard Alexander and minor input from me and our investor partner on this project  Mark Grover.

 

Darren does the most awesome job with large detailed pictures for the moulding company to use to make corrections.

 

The vast majority of the corrections are in the order of half a mm here and half a mm there, and are the fault of the tooling company, BUT COMPLETLY NORMAL and reasonable for first test shots, in fact much better than average.

 

The most obvious errors are the "height" of the wingtip tapes and the underwing panels (more on these coming; we know the variety of opinions held on them) which are FAR more prominent than designed, and will be corrected along with everything else.

 

There are a  few new design features we are adding, mainly to aid with alignment and fit.  They will likely be at my cost but will be money well spent if the build experience is as smooth as we think it will be.  

 

Mr Brown; Richard is aware of the feature just in front of the first exhaust pipe and has seen it on many Gs but despite looking has not seen it on a  K.  If you have a pic please share!  You can post here or email directly if you would rather keep it private.

 

The breather tube; similarly Richard has never seen it on a  K. He speculates (and I underline speculates) that because the K ejected the shell links etc there was no need for a separate gun gas ejector vent.  Again, we are happy to be corrected if you have the evidence.

 

Nick; of course we watch the message boards, and FB, and your email inbox, and we steam open your snail mail; we are EVERYWHERE; we know what you are thinking and saying....   

 

Just joking; but we do love all the feedback.

 

Cheers

 

M

 

PS  One thing we may not be able to satisfy everyone with is the tail wheel.  For some reason Richard and I think differently about tail wheels....however it is an ongoing debate so watch this space....

 

 

 

 

[Juggernut]

Thanks for the update and please do inform us as soon as the preorder link is live!  I'm on the Kotare email list so I should get it in due course but just sayin, this is one I don't want to miss.  Hell, I'll even buy the one Darin isn't.... 

 

As far as the pneumatic breather tube is concerned, clear views of that area are tough to come by (on the web) since the area is clouded by excessive soot.  I only found one shot and it's really not clear if it has the tube or not but I circled what, to me, appears to be said tube.  If I view it at a larger size  without distorting the image resolution, it does appear there's a pipe sticking out right behind the last exhaust stack.  This is in no way sufficient to act on but I'll keep looking and I'm' sure if someone has a good, clear photo of that area showing (or not) that pipe, it may make a difference.

 

EDIT:  It does appear that there is no breather in the subsequent photos posted so I must be seeing things that aren't there in the below photo.   Excellent research by the Kotare team!  I never would've thought it wouldn't be there.

 

Edited February 5, 2025 by Juggernut

[Martinnfb]

 

[Martinnfb]

no shroud, no pipe

 

confusion can be caused by this picture of white 16 with a bullet hole in the right location

[RBrown]

1 hour ago, Mark Robson said:

Mr Brown; Richard is aware of the feature just in front of the first exhaust pipe and has seen it on many Gs but despite looking has not seen it on a  K.  If you have a pic please share!  You can post here or email directly if you would rather keep it private.

 

 

Just to make everyone familiar with the feature in question here is a photo of the initial K mock up.

 

 

But there were changes to the production K that differed from the mock up.  Perhaps this feature was abandoned at some point, but it was present on some Ks in service.  Here is a shot of a JG 53 machine that appears to have the same blister. 

 

 

 

 

[Martinnfb]

Thank you for clarification, a tiny shroud baby. Now that I saw it, I can't un-see it.

 

Edited February 5, 2025 by Martinnfb

[Martinnfb]

[Christa]

Excellent outcomes are a cushy call? Yeah, right.

 

Applause, applause gentlemen.

[MikeMaben]

I posted this earlier. I doubt that it could be anything but what it says it is .

 

I'm thinkin' I may have posted this in Thunuss's build. 

 

 

Edited February 5, 2025 by MikeMaben

[CRAZY IVAN5]

36 minutes ago, MikeMaben said:

I posted this earlier. I doubt that it could be anything but what it says it is .

 

Yup. Now what version are we looking at a G-14 WNF, G-10 or K-4 ? From all the other pics posted above of K-4s , it looks like the K-4s don't have it, it would /should be visible I'd think even at the angles presented. Then again I'm nuts and don't you forget it.

[Juggernut]

Quote

Now what version are we looking at...?

 

That is a photo of the Bf109G-10/U4 and looks to be a photo from the Aero Detail book on the Bf109G.

[Martinnfb]

There’s no K in existence, so we have relay on the available WW2era photographs and documentation. 

[pvanroy]

Photographic evidence indeed seems to suggest that the at least the great majority of K airframes lacked the small bump in front of the first exhaust stack and very likely the pneumatic outlet for the MK 108. The suggestion that the pneumatic outlet was re-routed to exit through the shell ejection port makes eminent sense.

 

However, just to be sure, why not contact the people at Arsenal 45? They have been rebuilding a K-4 of Rammkommando Elbe for more than a decade, so I would expect them to have all the technical ins and outs of the K at their fingertips. 

Edited February 5, 2025 by pvanroy

[Juggernut]

Quote

However, just to be sure, why not contact the people at Arsenal 45? They have been rebuilding a K-4 of Rammkommando Elbe for more than a decade, so I would expect them to have all the technical ins and outs of the K at their fingertips. 

 

I wasn't aware there was an existing Bf109K-4 airframe anywhere in the world but I did just that (thank you Google translate - my German really is not good).  Hopefully, I'll get an answer and we'll all know shortly thereafter.

 

The air exhaust out the shell port does make sense.  Before the K-4, Bf109X-Y/U4 aircraft did not have a 30mm shell ejection chute and retained the spent shells in the aircraft?  I know they did that with the 20mm MG151 (if I'm correct) but never realized it was also applicable to the 30mm as the shells are just a tad bit larger.

Edited February 5, 2025 by Juggernut