Then LTC James Doolittle's B-25B Mitchell (Bureau Number 40-02344) in Color!

[George]

Gents:

 

I'm sharing information from Boeing showing a test flight of a B-25B (Bureau No. 40-2344) flying up California's Central Coast near Big Sur. The film originated from Boeing Corporation and is in color.  It clearly shows the Bombardier/Navigator's compartment as yellow-green and the cockpit as Bronze Green No. 9.  It is one of the definitive research pieces on the B-25B. Please note B-25s (A-C) were built at Inglewood (El Segundo) and B-25Ds and later variants were built at Kansas City.  

 

The dorsal turret frames appear painted in Dark Olive Drab 41.  It's possible some B-25Bs had "clear" turret frames but I wasn't alive back then.   I cannot verify the yellow-green color was ANA 611 Interior Green because aircraft manufacturers had some latitude with finish colors.   My best guess North American Aviation made its own recipe of yellow-green which may not be the same color as Douglas or any other military aviation manufacturer then.    

 

In terms of hobby paint colors, you can refer to AK Interactive Real Colors: WW2 Aircraft on page 185 for a description of "yellow-green."  I know AK makes "yellow-green" in acrylic (3rd Generation) and lacquer.  Mr. Hobby/Mr. Color Gunze makes an "interior green" color in acrylic (H58) which looks like a little like Tamiya's XF-04.  H58 used to be FS 34151 but the good folks reformulated the color.  Why they did that is a mystery.  It is mysterious as Tamiya having two spray paint versions of the RAF's Day Fighter Scheme (Ocean Gray and Dark Green over Medium Sea Gray).

 

The Bureau Number was verified from Joe Baugher's webpage: https://www.joebaugher.com/usaf_serials/1940.html

 

The Boeing link: https://secure.boeingimages.com/asset-management/2JRSXLJGEYZL?FR_=1&W=1536&H=835

 

Enjoy!  Regards, George

 

[Dana Bell]

Hi George,

 

Great find - not one I'd seen before.  However, despite the many similarities, that's not Doolittle's aircraft - it's a later plane repainted in his markings.  That doesn't invalidate any of your observations, but it does leave a door open...

 

Cheers,

 

 

 

Dana

[George]

It wouldn't make sense to fly a duplicate up and down the California Coast.  North American Aviation was under contract to deliver the B-25Bs, which was completed by December 1941.  

[Dana Bell]

Hi George,

 

I'm afraid I don't recall the source of my information - this is something I read back in the 1960s.  The main visible difference between Doolittle's aircraft and the immitation is the exhaust type.  I'll check my shelves to see if I can find the old refs.

 

Cheers,

 

 

Dana

[JeepsGunsTanks]

Isn't the one in this film very early? No rear gunner position... 

 

https://secure.boeingimages.com/asset-management/2JRSXLJGEYZL?FR_=1&W=2467&H=1331

 

[George]

15 minutes ago, Dana Bell said:

Hi George,

 

I'm afraid I don't recall the source of my information - this is something I read back in the 1960s.  The main visible difference between Doolittle's aircraft and the immitation is the exhaust type.  I'll check my shelves to see if I can find the old refs.

 

Cheers,

 

 

Dana

Hi Dana,

 

It is entirely possible this is a duplicate B-25.  My guess it is a B-25C painted up.  I doubt B-25Bs survived the war.  Nevertheless, the B-25C E&M manual indicates the bombardier/navigator compartment was painted "yellow-green".  

[Dana Bell]

Hi George,

 

Found my source - the first photo in Ray Wagner's 1966 Aircraft in Profile explains that the aircraft in the film was a "...late C or D model as indicated by the exhaust stacks" painted in Doolittle's markings for display at the USAF Museum.

 

While the E&M appears to be correct, it was designed for field use and often not applicable for factory production (which was covered by specifications rather than technical manuals).  Both documents changed with time, and both were often ignored (with or without Wright Field approval) at the factories.  North American's California facility was specifically excused from most interior priming/painting orders.

 

I mispoke earlier when noting the use of Bronze Green in the bombardier's compartment - as you noted, it was originally Yellow Green, later replaced by an unidentified green zinc chromate formula, then by Interior Green in 1943.

 

Here's my older explanation of Yellow Green and its evolution:  http://www.clubhyper.com/reference/showandtell1yellowgreendb_1.htm

 

Cheers,

 

 

Dana

[MikeMaben]

That's true even today Dana. I worked at Boeing from Feb. 1989 to May 2016, the last 10 years as a Process inspector.

One of the processes I worked with was the paint shop. They too had sample plates on the wall but were 'not'

used for any practical purpose. Primers were mixed just prior to use and could vary greatly from batch to batch.

Today they're water based and can change from the time they're mixed to the time they're cured. Some were heat

cured and some weren't.

[George]

Dana and Mike:  Thanks.   I'm glad we were able to unpack this.  I know the B-25B contract was fulfilled by December 1941 so maybe all of Bs were yellow-green.  It's anyone's guess as to the right shade because of monochrome photography back then could distort our perceptions.  Happy Thanksgiving!

[MikeMaben]

Happy holidays to you too George. 

[Citadelgrad]

On 11/21/2023 at 1:35 AM, MikeMaben said:

That's true even today Dana. I worked at Boeing from Feb. 1989 to May 2016, the last 10 years as a Process inspector.

One of the processes I worked with was the paint shop. They too had sample plates on the wall but were 'not'

used for any practical purpose. Primers were mixed just prior to use and could vary greatly from batch to batch.

Today they're water based and can change from the time they're mixed to the time they're cured. Some were heat

cured and some weren't.

Hey!  
 

I worked at Mcdonnell Douglas way back one summer in law school.  Eye opening for sure.  I worked the civilian side, but the military line was making C 17s right there next to us.  
 

i still have the lucite paperweight i got when our MRP team figured a way to safe something like $7 million a year.