Madmax Posted November 21, 2022 Author Share Posted November 21, 2022 Thanks Kev, John, Paolo, and Nick! Finally got some riveting done on the wings - well one of the wings anyway. I've been looking forward to this, since it really does pose some challenges, not least of which is finding an accurate drawing to refer to. I still haven't found one, but in my search I stumbled across the Scale Aviation Modeller (SAM) 3-view and I believe it to be the closest to the photographic references I have - it certainly helped. Here you can see the pattern taking shape, section by section. There is too much going on to do it in one go. Luckily the Hasegawa panels are accurate, and I only had to scribe one more panel line ahead of the flap cutout. Once again, I was keen to give the surface some character. I believe the trick is not to bulge every block of aluminium, but rather to see which ones are prominent on the actual aircraft. I don't have the technical specs, but I suspect that the thickness of the aluminium may differ from section to section, or that as the space between ribs and stringers increases, so too does the chance of bulging (pillowing, tin-canning etc). Here is an interesting thing: it looks to me as if the skin sags (rather than bulges) between the structural components of the ammunition bay door. I'm sure there are engineers out there who can chime in on this, but possibly because the rectangular structure is stressed differently to the wing itself? Note how the leading edge bulges outward between the ribs. Same here, just less pronounced. Whatever the reasons, I chose to incorporate some of what I saw on the wing. I may have overdone the ammo bay a little bit. Same as everyone else, I lowered the engine mount by a millimetre or two. It helps to build the kit years after the pioneers have discovered the problem areas! The wires sticking out of the nose are oil-cooler hoses that are just visible through the open cooling louvres on the back of the cowling. Fitting the resin engine is a bit of a shot in the dark, so I thought it might be good to keep at least one thing constant - the rear mount from the kit engine. This was trimmed on a trial and error basis till it looks like it might fit. Probably still needs some adjusting once the cowling is assembled. Here is the fake exhaust painted up in bas-relief. In place, it actually looks quite convincing. Back to the rivet wheel... Sean Troy Molitor, D.B. Andrus, Dpgsbody55 and 16 others 19 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheetah11 Posted November 21, 2022 Share Posted November 21, 2022 Wow Sean, the oil canning looks fantastic Madmax 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thunnus Posted November 22, 2022 Share Posted November 22, 2022 Glad to see this one back in action! Lots of good technical information on the Jug, which I am now interested in! Madmax 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brahman104 Posted November 22, 2022 Share Posted November 22, 2022 That is some damn fine work on the wings Sean! Very subtle effect, looks very nice indeed! Craig Madmax 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madmax Posted December 13, 2022 Author Share Posted December 13, 2022 Thanks Nick and Craig, this 'tin canning' thing is pretty addictive but very time consuming! I think my next build is going to be a jet that puts on anti-wrinkle cream at night. On 11/22/2022 at 7:23 AM, Thunnus said: Glad to see this one back in action! Lots of good technical information on the Jug, which I am now interested in! Hi John, I'm afraid this is going so slowly that it is actually me gaining information from your build as you overtake my progress! It is interesting to be able to compare the two kits and see the strengths or weaknesses in differing aspects of their designs. Here is a more detailed view of the riveting on top of the left hand wing. I filled in a panel that doesn't appear to be there in my reference pics. The heavy riveting on the inboard section of the wing is quite characteristic, and reflects the amounts of 'stringers' inside the wheel well. My rivet tally might look a bit overdone, but only represents about half of what is actually there! This was an incredibly rugged design and I imagine everything was riveted in place, including the standby-compass correction card. After much polishing with a micromesh cloth, this is a slightly more subtle result than the right hand wing. The bottom of the wings only got rivets, no skin texture. You can see where all the rivets on top of the wheel wells come from... Many of the fittings and interior surfaces are treated with zinc-chromate. I decided to do these now, as the masking gets too tricky if they are painted after the silver NMF (because the high shine ALCLAD's don't like masking tape too much). Then it was time to tackle the engine and cowling placement. The four-piece cowling design in the Hasegawa kit appears to be a turn-off for some prospective builders, but it isn't actually too much of a problem. The forward internal frame (to which the engine is attached) and the frame of the cowl-flaps are the key to getting the shape right. The first problems I encountered were associated with the resin engine, since it is clearly not the same dimensions as the kit engine. By attaching one cowl at a time, I was able to trim the locating tabs inside the cowl to accommodate the rocker covers. You may recall that I cut out the forward cowl fasteners, since they appear split once the cowl is joined (unless you get it absolutely perfect, and fill the tiny join line). Here, the styrene 'fasteners' are glued in prior to trimming and sanding. The Quickboost engine does look good - all snug in the cowling - but then the unknown variables started to catch up with me. There was a resin baseplate or 'backplate' that came with the engine, and I binned it. Mistake? Probably, since the attachment of the engine to the fuselage became an exercise in sheer guesswork and advanced cussing. You might want to hang onto the Quickboost part if you ever tackle this kit and engine combination. Here is the result of my folly... (btw: It doesn't help adding fiddly in-the-way details like the oil cooler hoses). Ah well, live and learn. Using the closed cowl-flaps to align things, it was eventually possible to get the entire power plant assembly approximately in place. At least from this side. I'll just glue the prop in skew to compensate for any other misalignments! John (aka Thunnus), I also had to re-scribe the cowling fasteners, that had become too vague after sanding the cowl joins. They sure do get skew in a hurry, no matter how hard you concentrate! Free hand scribing, even in shallow kit grooves, is a dark art. Wing to fuselage joins coming up next. I foresee some interesting results based on preliminary dry fitting. Not sure why I haven't read about a problem fit before? Probably because it doesn't exist, till now... Cheers, Sean Landrotten Highlander, D.B. Andrus, LSP_Kevin and 9 others 12 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TAG Posted December 13, 2022 Share Posted December 13, 2022 Admirable attention to detail complemented by top shelf modeling skills, good on ya Sean, this is going to be one of the best Hasegawa Jugs I've seen by the time you're through with it. Keep up the stellar work! Cheers, - Thomaz Madmax 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Stambaugh Posted December 13, 2022 Share Posted December 13, 2022 I say those same words"live and learn" on all my builds. Hmm.. But seriously, very nice work going on here. Madmax 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D.B. Andrus Posted December 13, 2022 Share Posted December 13, 2022 Beautiful work! Re. the "oil-canning" on the ammo doors - my view is that the armorers regularly walked on them hence the depressions. Plausible? Cheers, Damian MikeMaben, Madmax and Uncarina 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dpgsbody55 Posted December 13, 2022 Share Posted December 13, 2022 Great work so far. The engine looks good, and all that rivetting will really enhance the model. Cheers, Michael Madmax 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thunnus Posted December 13, 2022 Share Posted December 13, 2022 Ver nice work, Sean and yes, it's very interesting comparing the Trumpeter and Hasegawa kits. Your re-scribed fasteners look great... I was just not able to replicate that uniformity and opted for the tack-on brass pieces. Madmax 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheetah11 Posted December 13, 2022 Share Posted December 13, 2022 Nice one Sean, this is going to be a stunning model. A pity the build is going so slowly Madmax 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scvrobeson Posted December 14, 2022 Share Posted December 14, 2022 Beautiful work on the surface detail. Never knew that there was Yugoslavian P-47s. Your build is going to be absolutely stunning once paint hits it. Matt Madmax 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woody V Posted December 14, 2022 Share Posted December 14, 2022 On 6/18/2022 at 10:28 AM, TAG said: Here's a P-51 build I saw recently on YT Thanks for that link. Quite interesting approach. Madmax and TAG 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woody V Posted December 14, 2022 Share Posted December 14, 2022 (edited) On 11/21/2022 at 7:35 AM, Madmax said: I don't have the technical specs, but I suspect that the thickness of the aluminium may differ from section to section, or that as the space between ribs and stringers increases, so too does the chance of bulging (pillowing, tin-canning etc). I was an airframe repairman in the USAF and the bulged skin between rivet rows is caused by the riveting process. You're literally hammering the rivet with a rivet gun and as a consequence the skin gets compressed causing the skin to "grow" for lack of better term. All that now excess aluminum has to go somewhere so it forms that oil canning appearance. The skin on aircraft varies in thickness and thinner material has less resistance to being deformed. You're less likely to find oil canning on thicker material. Edited December 15, 2022 by Woody V scvrobeson, Madmax, Uncarina and 4 others 6 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madmax Posted December 14, 2022 Author Share Posted December 14, 2022 On 12/13/2022 at 4:22 PM, TAG said: Admirable attention to detail complemented by top shelf modeling skills, good on ya Sean, this is going to be one of the best Hasegawa Jugs I've seen by the time you're through with it. Keep up the stellar work! Cheers, - Thomaz Thanks Thomaz, I sure hope I can deliver the goods! On 12/13/2022 at 5:15 PM, John Stambaugh said: I say those same words"live and learn" on all my builds. Hmm.. But seriously, very nice work going on here. I'm pretty sure I'm going to say it again too... On 12/13/2022 at 5:45 PM, D.B. Andrus said: Beautiful work! Re. the "oil-canning" on the ammo doors - my view is that the armorers regularly walked on them hence the depressions. Plausible? Cheers, Damian Hey Damian, quite plausible indeed. I enjoyed working with many armourers in my military time and remember them as a spirited, naughty bunch. Walking on the wing? Yes sir! 23 hours ago, Dpgsbody55 said: Great work so far. The engine looks good, and all that rivetting will really enhance the model. Cheers, Michael Thanks Michael, I keep reminding myself of the outcome as I clean out rivet number 8725.... 21 hours ago, Thunnus said: Ver nice work, Sean and yes, it's very interesting comparing the Trumpeter and Hasegawa kits. Your re-scribed fasteners look great... I was just not able to replicate that uniformity and opted for the tack-on brass pieces. I saw that - smart move! 21 hours ago, Cheetah11 said: Nice one Sean, this is going to be a stunning model. A pity the build is going so slowly Nick, you are a very funny guy! 12 hours ago, scvrobeson said: Beautiful work on the surface detail. Never knew that there was Yugoslavian P-47s. Your build is going to be absolutely stunning once paint hits it. Matt Thanks Matt, I didn't know that was a Yugoslav roundel till you pointed it out! 6 hours ago, Woody V said: I was an airframe repairman in the USAF and the bulged skin between rivet rows is caused by the riveting process. You're literally pounding the rivet with a rivet gun and as a consequence the skin gets compressed causing the skin to "grow" for lack of better term. All that now excess aluminum has to go somewhere so it forms that oil canning appearance. The skin on aircraft varies in thickness and thinner material has less resistance to being deformed. You're less likely to find oil canning on thicker material. That's exactly the insight I was hoping for Woody! Thank you very much. scvrobeson and Woody V 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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