ICM Tiger Moth

[mozart]

Looks promising:

 

 

The foil will dull naturally over time, but I'll possibly give it a semi-matt coat first.

 

[mozart]

Another worthwhile day spent pondering rather than direct modelling!  I'm thinking ahead about painting, which I'm looking forward to but also aware of the challenges posed by the three main colours of G-ANFM and the demands of masking:

 

 

Silver obviously, a yellow which in some shots has a tinge of orange (and I like orange!), and black detailing, most notably the undercarriage.  This must be painted prior to fitting, the question is, can I pre-assemble the whole undercarriage and drop it into place?  I had previous reservations about the fineness of the forward support legs and sure enough one snapped in half when I was sanding it smooth!  Pre-assembly is rather awkward so I think it's painting then adding the u/c bit by bit.  

 

The wheels are quite a feature with the "DH" logo on the cover.  The ICM two-part wheels depict this but the further option is the MH Design 3D printed wheels which cover all options: no cover, plain cover, DH logo cover:

 

 

I should add that the Matchbox Tiger Moth wheels above don't really fit in here, they are some that I hand-painted some years ago.  For me, the MH Design ones win hands down, the Dunlop detail on the tyre is a bit heavy but I'll see what it looks like under some paint.

 

The other issue concerns rigging and the type of adjusters used at the end of each wire.  This is a typical Tiger Moth arrangement:

 

 

Brackets secured to the wing structure to which adjusters are fitted.  Replicating this isn't straightforward.  Both AIMS and Eduard provide their versions of the wing brackets on their frets, I'm favouring the Eduard ones from the point of view of ease of installation and of accuracy.  

 

But first I wanted to address the question of how best to secure small pieces of PE to the wing knowing that there would be a little tension on the elastic rigging line, so an experiment after posting a question on the Q&A section:

 

 

The gluing options above are:  1. UV 2. epoxy  3. thin CA  4.  gel CA  5.  Gator glue

 

Early gentle tests reveal that ALL pass the criteria in that they are solidly fixed to the wing.  I'll be trying the "pull" test tomorrow once everything has had a chance to set firmly.  

 

Then comes the question of tensioning devices!  The most accurate are the Gaspatch RAF type (1) BUT securing it to the wing is difficult because the "interface" is a large "tang" - it's difficult to envisage how to get this into the wing....I've seen it heated up and jammed into the plastic but you only get one go at this!  The other end is a narrow point which gives very little surface area on which to fix the rigging line, so they're good in theory but very tricky in practice.  The latter problem "could" be solved by sliding a piece of micro tube over the narrow end, with the rigging line secured inside the tube (2).  Which leads to the easiest option, just microtube which looks OK (3) in my opinion but it's important to get the angle of these right following the line of the rigging.  Gaspatch turnbuckles (4) are also easy to use, but not on the Tiger Moth.  

 

I'm currently favouring the Eduard brackets (shown not very clearly nearest the wing leading edge above) plus micro tube, but we'll see!

 

 

Edited January 19, 2023 by mozart

[europapete]

Interesting dilema here Max, I have the DH2 on the bench as we speak, and I have knocked up a working jig to test ideas and thoughts. Got a few WNW's waiting in the "wings" for a viable and credible solution to the eternal rigging problem. Not helped by the two types of wire, RAF and stranded cable. 

[europapete]

This subject really does deserve a well thought out study to figure out a readily useable and accurate solution. 

[europapete]

When you mask her up Max ( stop it, I'm talking about your model aeroplane!) don't forget that little bit of the fin is yellow. 

Edited January 20, 2023 by europapete
spelling!!!! you gotta be kidding me! lololol

[mozart]

18 hours ago, europapete said:

When you mask her up Max ( stop it, I'm talking about your model aeroplane!) don't forget that little bit of the fin is yellow. 

Already sorted Pete, have no fear. 

[mozart]

All the different glues used in my little experiment passed the test with flying colours when I did the "pull" test with a short length of the rigging material, so I'm spoilt for choice, but considering ease of use, of cleanness and of speed I'll be using UV glue I think.  Busy weekend, more on Monday.

[Derek B]

Fantastic work Max, I'm loving it! 

 

Derek 

[mozart]

Thanks Derek, I’m lovin’ the kit too, very much like I did ICM’s Gladiator. I’ve managed a bit of bench time today, fuselage and lower wings etc all primed and silver sprayed on the wings and empennage. Hoping to get the fuselage “oranged up” tomorrow afternoon. 

[mozart]

We have some colour on the Moth, starting to look quite smart:

 

 

The wheels really are delightful:

 

 

The doors are ICM’s and are OK apart from the thickness of the plastic, when you see the real thing you realise just how thin the wooden door actually is:

 

 

 

The two "pips" on the top edge is the locking/unlocking mechanism; squeeze them together and push the door to unlock.  These are represented well in the ICM doors, but I've taken a lot of plastic off the inside to get nearer the scale thickness.  The Eduard fret includes options for the doors, commendably thin but lacking in the locking "pips" and with little chance to add them.

Edited January 26, 2023 by mozart

[williamj]

On 11/27/2021 at 5:31 AM, mozart said:

I've been thinking about it for quite a while Richard so I hope the actual matches the vision!

 

Engines.....love 'em or hate em?!  The kit engine of the famous Gipsy Major, is rather lacking in detail.  Compare the left and right sides with the Lukgraph 3D-printed one above in both pictures:

 

 

but if you're planning on doing anything like this:

 

 

then the Lukgraph engine is a must:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  I have the Silverwings Moth, it is really a brilliant kit.    I was however disapointed to hear ICM woiuldn't be relaeasing the closed canopy RCAF version,

        I wanted one or two, but c'est la guerre.

Edited January 30, 2023 by williamj

[MikeC]

1 minute ago, williamj said:

I was however disapointed to hear ICM woiuldn't be relaeasing the closed canopy RCAF version,

        I wanted one or two, but c'est la guerre.

Me too; it looks like a totally different aeroplane (which of course it is), although still recognisable as a Tiger Moth.

[mozart]

45 minutes ago, williamj said:

  I have the Lukgrapgh Moth, it is really a brilliant kit.    I was however disapointed to hear ICM woiuldn't be relaeasing the closed canopy RCAF version,

        I wanted one or two, but c'est la guerre.

I didn’t know Lukgraph did a Tiger Moth William, unless you’re thinking of the Silver Wings one? 
 

 

Both companies based in Poland, both excellent. 

 

 

Edited January 26, 2023 by mozart

[Vince Blackburn]

On 1/19/2023 at 5:58 PM, mozart said:

Another worthwhile day spent pondering rather than direct modelling!  I'm thinking ahead about painting, which I'm looking forward to but also aware of the challenges posed by the three main colours of G-ANFM and the demands of masking:

 

 

Silver obviously, a yellow which in some shots has a tinge of orange (and I like orange!), and black detailing, most notably the undercarriage.  This must be painted prior to fitting, the question is, can I pre-assemble the whole undercarriage and drop it into place?  I had previous reservations about the fineness of the forward support legs and sure enough one snapped in half when I was sanding it smooth!  Pre-assembly is rather awkward so I think it's painting then adding the u/c bit by bit.  

 

The wheels are quite a feature with the "DH" logo on the cover.  The ICM two-part wheels depict this but the further option is the MH Design 3D printed wheels which cover all options: no cover, plain cover, DH logo cover:

 

 

I should add that the Matchbox Tiger Moth wheels above don't really fit in here, they are some that I hand-painted some years ago.  For me, the MH Design ones win hands down, the Dunlop detail on the tyre is a bit heavy but I'll see what it looks like under some paint.

 

The other issue concerns rigging and the type of adjusters used at the end of each wire.  This is a typical Tiger Moth arrangement:

 

 

Brackets secured to the wing structure to which adjusters are fitted.  Replicating this isn't straightforward.  Both AIMS and Eduard provide their versions of the wing brackets on their frets, I'm favouring the Eduard ones from the point of view of ease of installation and of accuracy.  

 

But first I wanted to address the question of how best to secure small pieces of PE to the wing knowing that there would be a little tension on the elastic rigging line, so an experiment after posting a question on the Q&A section:

 

 

The gluing options above are:  1. UV 2. epoxy  3. thin CA  4.  gel CA  5.  Gator glue

 

Early gentle tests reveal that ALL pass the criteria in that they are solidly fixed to the wing.  I'll be trying the "pull" test tomorrow once everything has had a chance to set firmly.  

 

Then comes the question of tensioning devices!  The most accurate are the Gaspatch RAF type (1) BUT securing it to the wing is difficult because the "interface" is a large "tang" - it's difficult to envisage how to get this into the wing....I've seen it heated up and jammed into the plastic but you only get one go at this!  The other end is a narrow point which gives very little surface area on which to fix the rigging line, so they're good in theory but very tricky in practice.  The latter problem "could" be solved by sliding a piece of micro tube over the narrow end, with the rigging line secured inside the tube (2).  Which leads to the easiest option, just microtube which looks OK (3) in my opinion but it's important to get the angle of these right following the line of the rigging.  Gaspatch turnbuckles (4) are also easy to use, but not on the Tiger Moth.  

 

I'm currently favouring the Eduard brackets (shown not very clearly nearest the wing leading edge above) plus micro tube, but we'll see!

 

 

Have you ever used Bob's Buckles?

[mozart]

Yep Vince, used them for years.