P-47 Questions

[John1]

Hi folks, 

 

I'm in the process of building this P-47D:

I noted the very small centerline tank (75 gal?).   Was this the standard 75 aluminum tank as used by P-51's or something else?  Does anyone have details on the brackets / fuel lines?

 

Also, does anyone happen to have a picture or two showing the undersides of WW2 era P-47's?   I'm trying to get a feel for what I need to do for weathering.   I'm having a hard time finding any decent shots.   

 

Lastly, this P-47 is an ex-Brazilian Jug that was returned to the USAAC.  Note the overpainted rudder and national insignia on the right wing.   As I understand it, the national insignia on the right wing was added in the field as an additional ID measure and did not have the "bars" present   For Jug's with this extra insignia, should I assume that a similar one was added under the port wing?

 

Thank you in advance! 

 

John

Edited August 28, 2021 by John1

[MikeMaben]

hth

[Joe Hegedus]

To answer your first question, yes.  The 75 gallon tank is the same standard tank used by the P-51.

[John1]

Thank you guys.   I got another one for you:   Any idea what color the prominent linkages are that suspend the flaps when they are in the lowered position?   I'm leaning towards Neutral Grey but for all I know, they could be YZC, natural metal or shocking pink.    Any info is most welcome.  

[adameliclem]

Hi John,

 

If you search for “crashed P-47 thunderbolt wing” there are some images of Jugs that suffered undercarriage failure on one side, tipping up the opposite wing and exposing more of the undersurface for the camera.

 

Here’s a good one, a P-47 that crashed in Northern Ireland. Note that the star-and-bars beneath the port wing is not all perfectly applied.

 

Here’s another one, “Lilliput” of the 334th FS, 4th FG.
 

 

There are a few similar shots of different aircraft out there but these two are the clearest I could find. 
 

Adam

[Citadelgrad]

1 hour ago, adameliclem said:

Hi John,

 

If you search for “crashed P-47 thunderbolt wing” there are some images of Jugs that suffered undercarriage failure on one side, tipping up the opposite wing and exposing more of the undersurface for the camera.

 

Here’s a good one, a P-47 that crashed in Northern Ireland. Note that the star-and-bars beneath the port wing is not all perfectly applied.

 

Here’s another one, “Lilliput” of the 334th FS, 4th FG.
 

 

There are a few similar shots of different aircraft out there but these two are the clearest I could find. 
 

Adam

Awesome photos, Adam.  The Lilliput one really shows the wingtip nav light.  

[adameliclem]

13 minutes ago, Citadelgrad said:

Awesome photos, Adam.  The Lilliput one really shows the wingtip nav light.  

Here’s another good one, of “hou la-la.” The wet hardstand surface helpfully bounces light up onto the wing undersurface.   
 

Adam

 

[LSP_K2]

2 hours ago, Jennings Heilig said:

This tank was commonly used in Italy.  I'm pretty sure it was a field (or possibly depot) mod of the 75 gallon teardrop tank. I've never found any kind of official documentation on it, nor any description of its capacity, but a SWAG is that it probably holds around 120 gallons.  Two vertical flanges where the two halves of the 75 gallon tank were joined to a constant width center section.

 

The isometric drawing is my copyrighted work.  I'd love to get somebody to do this up in CAD and 3D print some.  If you want to see this tank in action, watch the William Wyler film "Thunderbolt" about Jug action in Italy.

 

I don't see an isometric drawing, J.

[Juggernut]

1 hour ago, LSP_K2 said:

 

I don't see an isometric drawing, J.

 

I think he means orthographic.

Edited September 1, 2021 by Juggernut

[TAG]

On 8/28/2021 at 1:42 PM, John1 said:

Hi folks, 

 

I'm in the process of building this P-47D:

I noted the very small centerline tank (75 gal?).   Was this the standard 75 aluminum tank as used by P-51's or something else?  Does anyone have details on the brackets / fuel lines?

Hey, John

 

As mentioned, that is the standard 75-gallon drop tank commonly used on Mustangs. As has also been pointed out, there is a modified, extended version of the 75 gal tank that was frequently used in the Med/Italy, and quite extensively by the Brazilians. In Little Bunny/Norma's case, it does look indeed like the extended version, which would make sense as she was based in Corsica. Here's some pics of the extended 75-gallon, there seemed to be two versions, one with the fuel filler port located in the middle of the tank, and another with the filler port on the port side of the tank. Here's some photos, note the center-mounted filler port in the first two shots:

Couple of USAAF examples:

This is Wicked Wabbit (s/n 4275719), flown by Lt. James Hare, which is the same unit as your bird (57th Fighter Group) so more corroboration that Little Bunny/Norma would be using the extended tank. Note the mostly NMF engine bay (remember, only the engine mounts were painted YZC, cowling interiors were also left in NMF). This period color photo is also an excellent weathering reference!

 

 

On 8/28/2021 at 1:42 PM, John1 said:

 

Also, does anyone happen to have a picture or two showing the undersides of WW2 era P-47's?   I'm trying to get a feel for what I need to do for weathering.   I'm having a hard time finding any decent shots.   

As requested, here's an underside shot of an active duty dirty birdie. Grimy, oily and streaky are some good words to describe it.

On 8/28/2021 at 1:42 PM, John1 said:

 

Lastly, this P-47 is an ex-Brazilian Jug that was returned to the USAAC.  Note the overpainted rudder and national insignia on the right wing.   As I understand it, the national insignia on the right wing was added in the field as an additional ID measure and did not have the "bars" present   For Jug's with this extra insignia, should I assume that a similar one was added under the port wing?

 

Thank you in advance! 

 

John

You're correct in assuming that an extra national insignia on the right wing was added to avoid friendly fire incidents, but it actually came factory-applied. What was field-applied were the bars on the fuselage markings and the port upper and starboard lower wings, as per the USAAF. Here's an example of a factory-fresh Brazilian Jug with the original markings applied. It does seem to be missing the fuselage markings, however.

But not all Senta a Pua! Jugs had these extra markings, as these were only applied to the first deliveries to the Brazilian Air Force. Here's one with the extra marking on the port lower wing. Note the lack of bars, as per the BAF's original specs:

Here's one without the extra markings, note the crudely field-applied bars and regular 75-gallon tank on the centerline:

This one's got the extra markings AND the extended 75-gallon tank:

 

Hope that helped.

 

Cheers,

Thomaz

[TAG]

On 9/1/2021 at 12:27 PM, Jennings Heilig said:

I'd love to get somebody to do this up in CAD and 3D print some. 

 

 

Already been done, here's a link on Hyperscale to the product review, scroll to the end to see the extended 75-gallon tank in 1/32 scale: http://www.hyperscale.com/2021/reviews/accessories/fuelmodelsroundupdi_1.htm

 

[TAG]

On 8/30/2021 at 11:19 PM, John1 said:

Thank you guys.   I got another one for you:   Any idea what color the prominent linkages are that suspend the flaps when they are in the lowered position?   I'm leaning towards Neutral Grey but for all I know, they could be YZC, natural metal or shocking pink.    Any info is most welcome.  

 

Whoops, missed this one... Unlike restored birds which tend to have them in YZC, the Fowler flap linkages were painted in exterior colors for camouflaged planes (so Neutral Gray) and left in NMF on unpainted Jugs during wartime. I'll post some proper ref photos later, gotta run some errands first.

[Model_Monkey]

Test-printing a 1/48 scale extended tank with raised, offset cap today.  I'll post photos shortly.

[Model_Monkey]

Here you go!  Also available in 1/32 scale.  Photos below are of the 1/48 scale model.

 

 

 

Edited September 10, 2021 by Model_Monkey

[John1]

Yet another Jug question - for my subject, late war D, flying primarily air to ground missions in Italy, would it have commonly been fitted with 1,000 lb GP bombs?  Or just 500 pounders or napalm?