Wingnut Wings... We Really Did Lose Something Special

[RadBaron]

2 hours ago, Jennings Heilig said:

 

If they were viable (in other words, if they had been paying for themselves) we wouldn't have seen the end of WnW.  So based on my knowledge of the model hobby business, business in general, economics in general, and what was said in the Australian podcast about WnW specifically, kits of esoteric subjects with little or no historical relevance and/or gigantic size (and complexity, and cost) simply are *not* viable.  

 

 

I should have worded my response more clearly. I meant uncommon in broad terms of aircraft subjects, as opposed to the usual messer-spits etc.

 

Yes, during the "On The Bench" interview, it certainly sounds like the REALLY esoteric subjects (as much as I cant wait to build my Gotha G1, PJ chose THAT!?!) were the death of the company. I know they were tight lipped about sales, but i'd be surprised if the regular WWI aircraft, Camels, DVII's and Albatross' etc weren't good sellers. Think of how many releases sold out long before the company's demise, and subsequent rise of the WnW collector market. 

 

To that end, it'll probably be easy enough to find plenty more G1s and other unloved types, in years ahead, to reminisce over the good times

[vince14]

3 hours ago, GrahamF said:

I never did get the ww1 thing, far too niche in my opinion, I was always tripping over unsold stacks of them in model shops, despite the opposite opinion on forums.

Graham 

You'd certainly trip over them at my house, I've got about 90 1/32 WWI kits in the stash. Mind you, I don't have anything too niche in my stash, like a Spiteful or Seafang...

[MikeC]

9 hours ago, RadBaron said:

To that end, it'll probably be easy enough to find plenty more G1s and other unloved types, in years ahead, to reminisce over the good times

 

I suspect you're right.  Incidentally, out of curiosity I've just checked Hannants: as of today they have only two Wingnuts left, the Gotha G1 and UWD, with 20+ of each in stock.  I wonder how long that will take to decrease?  https://www.hannants.co.uk/search/index.php?product_category_id=&product_division_id=&manufacturer_id=362422&code=&product_type_id=&scale_id=&keyword_search=&setPerPage=25&currency_id=

[Pup7309]

17 hours ago, ringleheim said:

Copper State is a tiny operation, I'm not even sure the 2 guys (I believe) who own it do it as their full daytime job.

 

But they've already announced 3 new WWI kits and they are on the way.  

 

I don't think PUP is in denial about WNW.

 

Regarding the warehouse with stock: the kits that have been available over the last few months at places like MBK, Hannants, Andy's Hobby Headquarters, etc., were just a smattering of the current inventory.

All sorts of current production kits (i.e., non-retired) were never available from anyone over the last few months.

 

The Stahltaube is just 1 example.  Most of that stuff was coming from regional hubs where product had been stockpiled, having already left New Zealand.

 

In theory, there should still be a bunch of kits sitting in a warehouse in Wellington.

 

I do agree though, that as time goes on without these warehouse kits surfacing, they are unlikely to! 

 

I also think, down the road, Meng or other model companies who did the tooling/molding work for WNW kits of the past might re-pop them.  That's purely a question of whether or not Peter Jackson wants to sign his name and make a little bit of money.

 

He allegedly has $500 million US, but you can always do with a bit more! 

 

Again, if 5 years from now nothing like that has happened, it probably won't. 

 

But for now, we don't know.

 

 

 

 

Perfectly said!

WNW is dead. But it’s multi millionaire owner isn’t.

HK warehouse has been sold off to Europe and US 
What happens to remaining stock and when we have to wait to see

As mentioned what PJ does with the molds is up to him and anyone’s guess. We were lucky to see the Dr1, but it was always going to be a money spinner for whoever brought it out
 

[Pup7309]

14 hours ago, RadBaron said:

 

 

I should have worded my response more clearly. I meant uncommon in broad terms of aircraft subjects, as opposed to the usual messer-spits etc.

 

Yes, during the "On The Bench" interview, it certainly sounds like the REALLY esoteric subjects (as much as I cant wait to build my Gotha G1, PJ chose THAT!?!) were the death of the company. I know they were tight lipped about sales, but i'd be surprised if the regular WWI aircraft, Camels, DVII's and Albatross' etc weren't good sellers. Think of how many releases sold out long before the company's demise, and subsequent rise of the WnW collector market. 

 

To that end, it'll probably be easy enough to find plenty more G1s and other unloved types, in years ahead, to reminisce over the good times

Like a lot of people I didn’t purchase LVGs, Dh9 or Salmsons as other types appealed more. But after the downfall and subsequent tulip fever bidding frenzy these were still obtainable at RRP. Having got them I realise they really are fantastic (despite extra rigging) 

But obviously the single seat fighters were the first choice for modellers

 

[Pup7309]

16 hours ago, GrahamF said:

I never did get the ww1 thing, far too niche in my opinion, I was always tripping over unsold stacks of them in model shops, despite the opposite opinion on forums.

Graham 

Ironic isn’t it? They couldn’t give away Eindeckkers etc at one stage now they are being snapped up for hundreds... 

[Pup7309]

It’s been 6 months since their run ended. 

[Darren Howie]

The interesting thing to me is why the second biggest conflict in human history is considered a “niche” topic.

It may be niche to Americans but to other countries ie Great Britain, Canada, Australia, New Zealand, Germany, France etc etc its a huge part of their history.

Its been the ability to design kits with smaller tolerances to allow for the more complex engineering that has allowed WW to really launch an ignored genre.

Realistically its ignored because if you look at kit manufacturers other than Airfix not one manufacturer comes from a country which played a significant part in the first world war.

Why Roden even when Jackson said he would not tread on their toes refused to retool any kits or launch new ones to higher standards is beyond me.

They could of really surfed the wave with WW instead they did nothing leaving WW on their Own for a decade until CSM came in recently.

Very interested to see what happens we have an entire Spad family still to go plus Fokker D7’s now in theory gone until either WW returns as a shell ie just repopping kits already released or Jackson may Sell, lease or just keep the tooling.

Only time will tell..

 

[Guest Vincent]

On 9/11/2020 at 8:41 PM, RadBaron said:

One thing that WnW did, was show the business viability of high quality kits of uncommon types.

 

Their demise is the proof that it was not business viable

 

[Gazzas]

6 minutes ago, Vincent said:

 

Their demise is the proof that it was not business viable

 

It would have been interesting to see how it would have went had they stuck to frontline fighters and the few other highly desired types.  Hopefully Roden will decide to make better kits.

[Guest Vincent]

2 minutes ago, Gazzas said:

It would have been interesting to see how it would have went had they stuck to frontline fighters and the few other highly desired types.  Hopefully Roden will decide to make better kits.

 

Dunno. Every kit manufacturer's release planner i had the the chance to talk to have told me the same : It's a fine balancing act between the subjects that will generate revenue over the years and the re-releases and subjects that might be a total flop. Usually developements costs are near the same in both cases so you can't have too many flops before the company goes belly up. The chinese availability of lower costs mold makers has eased that pain a little which we can see with the release of more and more obscure models

[LSP_Mike]

I just got my WNW Gotha G1 in the mail. Quite a kit! That said, it is a niche kit in a niche market. Had WNW spaced a few other mainstream types in the mix, WNW might still be running. 

   On opening my G1 kit though, I realized we may never see kits the like of these again.

[RadBaron]

12 hours ago, Vincent said:

 

Their demise is the proof that it was not business viable

 

See my clarification above, which goes along with what Gazzas said.

[Juggernut]

12 hours ago, Vincent said:

 

Their demise is the proof that it was not business viable

 

 

I seem to have read in an article someplace that Sir Peter said that if/when WnW ever stopped being, for lack of the more appropriate term, "fun", he'd close the doors and apparently, that's what happened.  I don't believe it was ever about the "business" for him but more about his passion and interests.  Of course, nobody will ever know unless Sir Peter comes right out and says it but that is what I've read. Let's also be honest...Sir Peter was NOT in it for the money.

Edited September 17, 2020 by Juggernut

[LSP_K2]

I of course have no idea how actual sales went for WNW, but I do recall that way more than once, when a new kit was announced, I'd just scratch my head and wonder why. Some of the very early releases still hadn't sold out, even after nearly ten years of availability, whereas others; Fokker D.VIIs and Albatros Vs, seem to sell out a whole lot quicker. I can easily see why even the most ardent of WWI aviation fans, would balk at some of the bizarre choices of kits released.