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Harness confusion


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To properly anneal brass, first get it hot to the point where it turns dark cherry red and then immediately quench it in water.

I just gave up on fabric and PE belts and make them out of paper. Assemble using the kit (HG or whatever) PE parts and wet them with water and they just flop into position.

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I don't think my lighter can get them that hot, unfortunately. They mostly turned black when I tried. Gonna cut off the broken Y-harness and only keep the buckle at the bottom, and make the rest out of tape. Thanks everyone for your inputs.

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Now to add to the can of worms, does the Y piece come from behind the seat and up and over or is it threaded through the oblong hole near the bottom of the seat back.

My opinion is that it goes up and over, but it kind of makes more sense to go through the hole. Every drawing I have looked at suggests the up and over and that is how I always position them. But I have a nagging doubt...

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6 minutes ago, DonH said:

Now to add to the can of worms, does the Y piece come from behind the seat and up and over or is it threaded through the oblong hole near the bottom of the seat back.

My opinion is that it goes up and over, but it kind of makes more sense to go through the hole. Every drawing I have looked at suggests the up and over and that is how I always position them. But I have a nagging doubt...

 

I had a look at a couple of Radu's and HGW's Sutton Harness belts instructions which I have, both suggest to pass the lower single piece end of the Y-harness through

the oblonged (or maybe oval) opening at the lower part of the back rest. HTH

Lothar

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The Sutton shoulder harness consisted of two main components: 

- one set of straps that was intended to restrain the up/down movement (keep the bottom on the seat) . This is the Y-shaped harness that goes down. This passed through a wide opening in the seat back rest and secured to a hard point under the seat. It makes no technical sense for this to pass over the seat rest - the harness will not work as intended (see next part) 

- one set of straps that was intended to restrain the forward/back movement (keep the back against the seat rest). This is the V-shaped harness that went over he seat and was connected to a cable that passed through the head rest. The other end of the cable was connected to a spring, or a spool, or a bungee that allowed the wearer to move forward and back while keeping the harness taut. This cable could be locked by a "brake" that was controlled by a lever on the side of the seat and by moving this lever the wearer could lock/loosen the cable thus allowing him/her to move forward/back or lock the harness in place so that, for example, he/she would not get a mouthful of gun sight in a crash. This forward/back movement is exactly the same as any car seat belts of today, with the difference that today's car seat belts have an automatic lock in case of a sudden stop, whereas on the Sutton harness the lock was hand-controlled. 

The two harnesses were connected to each other via buckles at shoulder level. 

So, to summarise, the harness consisted of two components: a component that held the wearer's bottom in the seat no matter if the plane was flying level or upside-down and a component that allowed the wearer to move forward/back (and around, to look back, for example). 

The lap belts were intended to keep the pelvis from sliding forward (they call that "submarining" in car racing). 

Radu 

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33 minutes ago, Radub said:

 

The lap belts were intended to keep the pelvis from sliding forward (they call that "submarining" in car racing). 

Radu 

 

They call it that in crash testing too

 

Richard

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On 5/2/2020 at 7:47 AM, Radub said:

The Sutton shoulder harness consisted of two main components: 

- one set of straps that was intended to restrain the up/down movement (keep the bottom on the seat) . This is the Y-shaped harness that goes down. This passed through a wide opening in the seat back rest and secured to a hard point under the seat. It makes no technical sense for this to pass over the seat rest - the harness will not work as intended (see next part) 

- one set of straps that was intended to restrain the forward/back movement (keep the back against the seat rest). This is the V-shaped harness that went over he seat and was connected to a cable that passed through the head rest. The other end of the cable was connected to a spring, or a spool, or a bungee that allowed the wearer to move forward and back while keeping the harness taut. This cable could be locked by a "brake" that was controlled by a lever on the side of the seat and by moving this lever the wearer could lock/loosen the cable thus allowing him/her to move forward/back or lock the harness in place so that, for example, he/she would not get a mouthful of gun sight in a crash. This forward/back movement is exactly the same as any car seat belts of today, with the difference that today's car seat belts have an automatic lock in case of a sudden stop, whereas on the Sutton harness the lock was hand-controlled. 

The two harnesses were connected to each other via buckles at shoulder level. 

So, to summarise, the harness consisted of two components: a component that held the wearer's bottom in the seat no matter if the plane was flying level or upside-down and a component that allowed the wearer to move forward/back (and around, to look back, for example). 

The lap belts were intended to keep the pelvis from sliding forward (they call that "submarining" in car racing). 

Radu 

Great explanation Radu. This really cleared up how  a sutton harness works. Now when my two (yours of course) sutton harnesses arive in the mail I'll be able to install them in my 1/32 Beaufighter correctly.

Thanks Ron G 

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1 hour ago, RonGUSA said:

Great explanation Radu. This really cleared up how  a sutton harness works. Now when my two (yours of course) sutton harnesses arive in the mail I'll be able to install them in my 1/32 Beaufighter correctly.

Thanks Ron G 

 

Hi Ron,

Thanks for your support. Unfortunately you will have to wait another little while longer. The lockdown was supposed to be lifted on next Tuesday but the Irish Government extended it for another two weeks. We are still waiting for deliveries of basic materials (we have no postal packaging, for example) as many of our suppliers are also closed and packages seem to be stuck in postal sorting limbo. The post office cannot accept packages for certain destinations. I hope we will be able to dispatch the ordeds then, but we have no control over these restrictions. 

Radu

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