F-4 Phantom centreline fuel tank

[Anthony in NZ]

Just now, Dave Williams said:

Centerline tanks on RAF phantoms seem very rare.  Much more likely to be empty or carrying a SUU-23 gun pod.  The only centerline tanks I’ve seen on British F-4s are the original Royal Jet tank on RN FG1s.  I don’t think they were ever modified to carry the F-15 tank.  Unless you found a photo, I’d leave the centerline tank off, and if you must use one, I’d only use the Royal Jet tank.

Thanks Dave, much appreciated mate.  You are correct.  I have just been searching and they rarely ever carried them.  Saw what was some sort of Recce pod on camouflaged ones though.  Possibly never used on late FGR's either...

 

I really want to get this kit/conversion right...

[Dave Williams]

5 minutes ago, Anthony in NZ said:

Thanks Dave, much appreciated mate.  You are correct.  I have just been searching and they rarely ever carried them.  Saw what was some sort of Recce pod on camouflaged ones though.  Possibly never used on late FGR's either...

 

I really want to get this kit/conversion right...

That was the EMI Reece pod that was used only by 2 and 41 Squadrons.  Only about 30 FGR 2s were modified to carry the pod.

[Anthony in NZ]

3 minutes ago, Dave Williams said:

That was the EMI Reece pod that was used only by 2 and 41 Squadrons.  Only about 30 FGR 2s were modified to carry the pod.

Aaah thanks I thought I read somewhere that very few were modified to carry them.

 

I agree, leave it empty or put on a SUU-23...

 

Thanks for answering my question

[Michael931080]

6 hours ago, Jennings Heilig said:

Here are the pics I've taken of the two ex-Thunderbirds aircraft here in Tucson.  I wasn't aware that those two big pipes sticking out of the belly were part of the F-15 centerline tank mount.  Any idea how that worked??  That area is in deep shadow, so it's hard to see any details in period photos of F-4s carrying that tank.

 

Nice pics of the Ex-Thunderbird!  And of the Pima bird details.

[ade rowlands]

All great stuff. Thanks guys. Whilst I can't get a copy of the Model Art F-4 JASDF book as its long out of print, along with the Wolfpack Designs update set I have got a copy of a photo book from Model Art on the way which looks to be celebrating their final year of service which should provide me with some detail shots to have a go at the conversion myself. I'm not bothered about cockpit changes as it will be canopy closed anyway. More the lumps, bumps and antennae added here and there and the nose cone too.

 

https://www.1999.co.jp/eng/10603862  

 

So as I see it, in the middle of the tank there is no connection between the F-4 belly and the tank other than some pipes and 4 sway braces, then at the ball joint the connection between tank and F-4 is that black block. 

Edited February 6, 2020 by ade rowlands

[Ben Brown]

Here's what I have. Sorry, they're not as good as I remembered, since I hadn't gone digital back then. I also have a diagram of the tank, showing what each pipe does, but I can't find it. I'll post it when I do.

 

Mike Valdez posted some great photos of the tank removed from the Collings F-4D over on Hyperscale, but they were lost in the Great Photobucket Debacle. They show the two mounting lugs, two large pipes and a smaller one on top of the tank. I saved them and can post them with credit to him if there are no objections.

 

 

Looking aft from in front of the port aux air intake door.

 

Looking aft from the starboard side.

 

Forward is to the right on this one.

 

Ben

 

Edited February 6, 2020 by Ben Brown

[Lothar]

Reading through this post am I correct to assume that later RF-4Cs could be equipped with this

tank as well? I've just checked my Revell kit and there's a very large tank included, pressumably

the 600 gls. F-15 tank?

 

Lothar

[Dave Williams]

2 hours ago, Lothar said:

Reading through this post am I correct to assume that later RF-4Cs could be equipped with this

tank as well? I've just checked my Revell kit and there's a very large tank included, pressumably

the 600 gls. F-15 tank?

 

Lothar

Yes, the RF-4Cs could carry the F-15 high speed tank later in life.

[allthumbs]

This link has some interesting close up pictures of the tank...

 

https://www.britmodeller.com/forums/index.php?/topic/71084-mcdonnell-douglas-f-15ac-eagle/ (scroll to the bottom)

 

From a distance, the tank looks boring and featureless. But up close, details begin to emerge. These include the aforementioned mounting lugs (spaced 30 inches apart) and connection points for fuel, air and electrical. There's also a fuel cap opening and a grounding point on the forward portion of the tank, the former offset to the left, the latter to the right. Also, dozens of large dome-head fasteners festoon the tank along reinforcement points.

 

 

I used these photos, along with other references, to super detail this tank from the Revell 1:48 F-15E Strike Eagle...

 

Edited February 6, 2020 by allthumbs

[phasephantomphixer]

The F-15 tank was modified a bit for F-4 use. It appears one way was switching nose and tail cone as the two fuel pipe connections are forward on F-4 (includes smaller electrical connector in front of them) and the oval access panels on the sides of tank are in different locations. Quick way to tell if your chosen F-4 had F-15 tank conversion is the large rear mount (spoken of and pictured in thread) as it remained a permanent part of the plane. there are two center mount lugs, four sway braces. When installing the tank, usually three of us would use the cradle to locate it, lift aft end, engage rear mount ball into mount, lift front of tank so lugs engage while one would lock the lugs from within the Aux air door. While raising the tank one would watch the fuel pipes for alignment to ensure the o-ring seals don't get damaged. Then whoever had the smallest hands would turn the elec. connector and safety wire it. Then the sway braces would be tightened against the tank while another would wiggle tank to take out slack. At least that is what I recall from 30 years ago...

So the tank angles upward at the front with only an inch or so gap from belly.  HTH

[ade rowlands]

This is all excellent stuff. I was ready to can my F-4EJ Kai project because I couldn’t get a hold of the Wolfpack conversion set and get a Regular Tamiya F-4E and do a SEA Scheme instead (Still might do that as I like the F-4 quite a bit and I have decals for Steve Ritchies F-4E). So Tamiya F-4EJ is ready in the basket for next pay day. I’ve managed to source a book on the JASDF F-4 (it’s Japanese text but lots of Photos) and with these pics posted by you guys I’m in a good position to have a go at it without the conversion set. Got DXM Decals on the way too.

Edited February 6, 2020 by ade rowlands
Auto spell. Always bloody auto spell.

[Tony T]

16 minutes ago, Jennings Heilig said:

 

All USAF and most (if not all, except the Brits) foreign users of the F-4 switched to the F-15 tank starting in the mid-1980s.

 

Britain and Israel let it pass by.

 

I know the block permanently fastened onto the fuselage didn't interfere with stubby SUU-23/A installations, but the RAF had pointy ended gunpods only (in spite of the 1/48 Hasegawa kit) and were skint (either or both being a factor) while the Israelis used regular c/l tanks with the rear cones removed and carried some recce goodies, like Goodyear SAR, stuffed into them. 

 

Used to know all the TOs for this but life moves on. It is fascinating all the same, albeit thirty-five years have passed. 

 

Tony 

[thierry laurent]

By the way for obvious reasons IRIAF Phantoms never used such tanks either. 

[John1]

16 hours ago, Jennings Heilig said:

 

Oh I don't know.  Ollie North would probably have happily sold them F-15 tanks if they'd only asked

That shyster would have happily sold them F-15's if they asked.