Relic Plywood pieces from a BF-109 G10

[Antonio Argudo]

25 minutes ago, LSP_Matt said:

The only 'museum level' method of determining colour accurately is to use a scientific instrument. An instrument that measures the reflected wavelength of light of different samples but which is calibrated from a standard. A reflected wavelength analysis will objectively determine what the colours of any objects are irrespective of our potentially fallible human visual system. I looked it up...a Multiangle Spectrophotometer.

 

thanks Matty for your reply,  I totally Agree with you so that's why I'm sending it to a professional  who has a spectrocolorimeter and base color data, so more precise info we'll have 

cheers

Antonio

[Kagemusha]

But then as Jennings has alluded, it might not determine the true colour when applied due to ageing, it's like when you see a Great Master cleaned, the colours come back, but I guess using a different type of cleaner the colours might be a bit different, and it's impossible to determine what the exact colours were when applied. 

 

Fascinating, and I look forward to hearing the results. 

[Antonio Argudo]

45 minutes ago, Kagemusha said:

it's impossible to determine what the exact colours were when applied. 

Hi Kagemusha,

yes probably true,  but even getting   close to  the "Exact color"  would be very interesting and worth the effort, cheers

Edited August 10, 2019 by Antonio Argudo

[Guest Vincent]

Class 33 lacquers in RLM nomenclature means paints formulated to be applied on non metal supports, like wood in this case. Applying a metal class lacquer on the wood putty would damage it over time with possible dire consequences. You normally had a warning on every wood assembly stating "to be repaired only with class 33 aviation lacquers" like on the rudder fin from the auction

 

This thread will be fun until we get the "parts in my garage" card, or the "my friends from the german paint industry" card or the "i'm an academic, you're not" card.

 

 

Just to illustrate the minefield, i have few parts from a crashed Ju88A4 in Finland. Parts from the same time frame, same factory (they are not subcontracted) and at least 3 variations of RLM02 on them.

 

So...

Edited August 10, 2019 by Vincent

[BiggTim]

4 hours ago, LSP_Matt said:

The human visual system interprets information but it's accuracy is affected by,  a mans genes, neural processing or even ambient luminosity.

 

This should be fun, collaborative and informative.

 

Matty

Pretty much exactly the point I was going to make. Our eyes and brains interpret color with very subtle differences from person to person,  even without the differences in our tech.

 

One thing that is undeniably obvious is that the three paint samples Antonio posted next to the relics match very well, even considering all the variables. I'd use them happily.

[Antonio Argudo]

9 hours ago, BiggTim said:

ne thing that is undeniably obvious is that the three paint samples Antonio posted next to the relics match very well, even considering all the variables. I'd use them happily.

 

Thanks Tim for your words, 

 this is comparative just for fun with the  Monogram's Luftwaffe Painting Guide, also found this interesting video with  paint colors  comparison with AK interactive, Gunze Lacquer and Model Master paints,  sadly is only in korean

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

cheers

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited August 11, 2019 by Antonio Argudo

[Gazzas]

Great thread with great input! 

[Guest Vincent]

The 76 on your part looks to lean toward the so called "RLM84" hue. Regular 76 was plain blue

[Antonio Argudo]

2 hours ago, Vincent said:

The 76 on your part looks to lean toward the so called "RLM84" hue. Regular 76 was plain blue

Thanks Vincent for your comment, 

I guess I'm going to  have to refine my chart, a work in progress indeed,  it is due to  photography  lighting,  it looks more blueish in the flesh  and to me matches  with this relic in Poland, and  also I can "feel"  relation with the  76 on the airtake of the australian 109,  it is a very intense color in the flesh,  very particular one.

cheers

 

 

 

 

Edited August 11, 2019 by Antonio Argudo

[LSP_Matt]

23 hours ago, Antonio Argudo said:

Thanks Vincent for your comment, 

I guess I'm going to  have to refine my chart, a work in progress indeed,  it is due to  photography  lighting,  it looks more blueish in the flesh  and to me matches  with this relic in Poland, and  also I can "feel"  relation with the  76 on the airtake of the australian 109,  it is a very intense color in the flesh,  very particular one.

cheers

 

 

 I took a heap of photos of the German planes in our Aussie War Memorial. They're in the walkaround section.

 

If I recall correctly, the museum had gone to great lengths to preserve the original colours from WW2. If you approached the museum you might find they have some scientific information about the colours they could pass along. There's a Me262 and a Me163, V1 and more there as well.

 

 

HTH.

 

Cheers Matty

[mozart]

......but not great lighting conditions for good photography, especially where the Bf109 is hanging! 

[Tony T]

The RLM 74 looks definitely blue-grey to my eyes, and the 75 purple-grey.

 

That's the way I've interpreted them for a very long time, so it's quite reassuring seeing these samples. 

 

Unfortunately, there are people who insist Kalamata olives are all exactly the same green-brown. They look at labels at not the contents.

 

Tony 

[LSP_K2]

2 hours ago, Tony T said:

Unfortunately, there are people who insist Kalamata olives are all exactly the same green-brown. They look at labels at not the contents.

 

Tony 

 

Interesting what you say about the olive color. I've seen several Fokker Dr.I kits painted up in a garish green that looks nothing like any olive color I've ever seen, but that's just me.

[Antonio Argudo]

Thanks Tony and Kevin for your comments, 

today I've been doing some mixing paints to try to match  my samples using Gunze Hobby Color Aqueous.

 in the first picture you can see both pure paints, on the right it is  Gunze H417  "rlm 76" which is not a good match  to my sample

beside is Gunze H 314  (blue FS 35622 Israeli Kifir)  straight out of the bottle,   pretty close  but misses a bit of blue tonality, I added  a very small  hint of pure  blue,  and  15%  of white and  finally got a decent  representation of my sample ( some grime and dirt on the edge of   my sample but can be seen but  the center   was fine sanded and cleaned)

On the second picture it is my final mix, I used an old  1/32 "B" Mustang  to do some  spray test at least "B" Mustangs and 109's  have some similar forms 

so, this for now,  next I'll be spraying RLM 75 which I also got a good mix  match for.

cheers

 

Edited August 12, 2019 by Antonio Argudo

[Shiba]

2 hours ago, Antonio Argudo said:

"B" Mustang  to do some  spray test, at least B Mustangs and 109  have some similar forms 

 

Hi, Antonio,  Very interesting thread and I like what you doing   Thank you for sharing !!　

Regards,

Matsu.

 

 

Edited August 12, 2019 by Shiba