1/18 Scale Blue Box F4U-1A Corsair Modification

[easixpedro]

On 5/13/2023 at 2:31 PM, JayW said:

All period photos of Corsairs in fighting units show alot of tape marks around these muzzles, if not taped entirely ready to go.  I wonder how I might reproduce that (tape marks; I do not plan to cover these holes).  Accepting ideas. 

Jay,

On my Hellcat scene I used strips of white decal from the spares bin to mimic the tape and punched through it. Also used a bit of really dried up Tamiya seam filler to give the decals a bit more 3D ripped effect.  Top half of this page here: 1/24 F6F-5 Hellcat--In Flight - Page 8 - Works in Progress - Large Scale Planes 

 

I know you don't want to cover up your glorious work, but they were taped for good reason. It kept gunk out of the primary weapons system... I say do it as a post-flight, they've been used and shot through.

-Peter

 

 

[JayW]

5 hours ago, easixpedro said:

Jay,

On my Hellcat scene I used strips of white decal from the spares bin to mimic the tape and punched through it. Also used a bit of really dried up Tamiya seam filler to give the decals a bit more 3D ripped effect.  Top half of this page here: 1/24 F6F-5 Hellcat--In Flight - Page 8 - Works in Progress - Large Scale Planes 

 

I know you don't want to cover up your glorious work, but they were taped for good reason. It kept gunk out of the primary weapons system... I say do it as a post-flight, they've been used and shot through.

-Peter

 

Yeah - I recall that.  So I thumbed through VF-17 again (cannot count how many times I have done it; it's getting dog-eared), looking for photos of the gun ports.  Lots of them.  And from the perspective of tape, they were all over the place.  Many with neatly covered individual ports, some with a wide swath of tape covering all ports at once, some with no indication of tape, and some with obvious tape residue like this:

 

 

That aircraft is in bad need of a bath.  But that is the look I would like to simulate (the tape).  I wonder if some Mr. Surfacer primer, masked carefully to show tape residue, might do the trick.  Then stain it and make it ugly.

 

What I did not see is tape still there but shot through.  I can only surmise that once shot through, the aero drag just ripped the remainder off.  ???

Edited May 17 by JayW

[chuck540z3]

28 minutes ago, JayW said:

That aircraft is in bad need of a bath.  But that is the look I would like to simulate.  I wonder if some Mr. Surfacer primer, masked carefully to show tape residue, might do the trick.  Then stain it and make it ugly.

 

What I did not see is tape still there but shot through.  I can only surmise that once shot through, the aero drag just ripped the remainder off.  ???

 

Your Corsair continues to amaze us all- and your skinning looks like it's now becoming a routine step?  Lots and lots of practice I'm sure.

 

As for weathering and FWIW coming from me, I think you have already hit the sweet spot of weathering on your fuselage and inner wings, so are you suggesting that you're going to add even more grime?  Yeah the pic above is even grubbier, but was it really typical, or just a cool shot of a very dirty bird to justify even more wear and tear?  I vote to match what you've already done, which is excellent.  If you want a bit more of a worn look, using even more flat coat can really make a model "pop" and look the part.

 

I think you've already made the decision on whether to use tape or just create residue surrounding the gun holes.  With all the tape you have used on the panels forward of windscreen, there's a very high chance that the tape over the guns would be from the same source.  Maybe a bit cleaner perhaps?

 

Cheers,

Chuck

[JayW]

1 hour ago, chuck540z3 said:

so are you suggesting that you're going to add even more grime?

 

No no no Chuck.! I didn't mean that.  I worded that post badly.  No, I only want to somehow depict messy tape residue.  I will not further grime up this Corsair.  Yeah!   Maybe I can do something with that white Tam tape.  Thanks! 

Edited May 17 by JayW

[easixpedro]

3 hours ago, JayW said:

 

Yeah - I recall that.  So I thumbed through VF-17 again (cannot count how many times I have done it; it's getting dog-eared), looking for photos of the gun ports.  Lots of them.  And from the perspective of tape, they were all over the place.  Many with neatly covered individual ports, some with a wide swath of tape covering all ports at once, some with no indication of tape, and some with obvious tape residue like this:

 

 

That aircraft is in bad need of a bath.  But that is the look I would like to simulate (the tape).  I wonder if some Mr. Surfacer primer, masked carefully to show tape residue, might do the trick.  Then stain it and make it ugly.

 

What I did not see is tape still there but shot through.  I can only surmise that once shot through, the aero drag just ripped the remainder off.  ???

I think we’re talking the same thing. This photo shows tape still in place (residue?) but cooked from the muzzle flash. Ever seen a .50 cal shoot? It’s impressive. I think some decal strips on the outer edge, with stippled Mr. surfacer around the gun ports. Paint ‘em to match and give it some smoke to replicate the burnt aspect from the muzzle flash. 
 

I also think you can use some artistic license here, as lord only knows how the tape behaved with a bag of knots, G’s and heat from the blast. And who knows what type of tape they were actually using?! I know what modern ordie tape (aka 400 MPH tape) is/does, but not back then. We’re all probably overthinking this problem, but that’s what we do  

 

Anxious to see what you come up with!

[MikeMaben]

On 5/16/2023 at 3:15 PM, JayW said:

   ...I wonder if some Mr. Surfacer primer, masked carefully to show tape residue, might do the trick.  Then stain it and make it ugly.

 

Yeah that tape was pretty flimsy. Looks like taped like crosses. I've used that white paper that comes in shoe boxes

with a new pair of shoes. Get it wet with a white glue and water mixture (less sticky than Tam tape), let it dry then

chop it up as needed.  It doesn't look like much in the way of cordite staining on the barrel openings.

Tweaked the pic a little ...

 

 

hth

 

 

 

Edited May 18 by MikeMaben

[Woody V]

2 hours ago, MikeMaben said:

I've used that white paper that comes in shoe boxes

 

Great idea! 

[Thunnus]

I love your work on the wings, Jay!  Another possible way to do the tape marks around the gun openings is to use hairspray.

[JayW]

Hey guys and gals - As my poor right hand and wrist recover from hundreds upon hundreds of fastener punch marks on the wing leading edge panels (I am not exaggerating), I am doing a Rhino model of the ailerons.  In real life, they are made of wood, so no fastener marks or fabric covered bays to worry about.  And if I can get the shape right, they make good candidates for 3D printing.  I have been studying the drawings of the aileron, and for the life of me I cannot decipher the poorly detailed views of the inboard end.  Here is what I have so far in Rhino (it isn't complete) -  and the inboard end trim is a guess at this point:

 

 

 

The inboard end, at least for the -1A's onward (the birdcage Corsairs, at least the earlier ones, did not have this feature) has a small balance tab with a horn fitting and a push rod to control its attitude as the aileron swings up and down.  This pushrod, just as with the elevator balance tabs, has one end attached to the horn fitting on the tab, and the other attached to fixed structure, in this case piggy backed onto a flap support fitting.  I have not yet modeled this push rod.  These connections are at the extreme inboard end, nestled up against the outboard flap, and necessitate a fairly severe trim to the aileron skins to clear it all.  The top assembly drawing of the aileron, which collects the aileron and the tabs and their attaching hardware, shows this sort of:

 

 

But I can't read the detail drawing!  Can you?  Detail drawing VS-24019 "Aileron Assembly":

 

 

 

The upper trim is not the same as the lower trim, but just how they differ is not clear on the drawing.  Anybody have any pictures of the aileron that might help me?  I cannot find any. 

Edited May 21 by JayW

[Kaeone57]

Jay, Keep on keeping on!!

 

Alfonso 

[JayW]

Thought I'd show you some pictures of the ailerons; the Rhino layout model is just about complete.

 

LH aileron:

 

 

RH aileron:

 

 

 

Note the RH aileron lacks the trim tab, but both have a balance tab.  Also note the mid hinge cutout is smaller (it doesn't have to make room for the tab control stuff).

 

Attach lugs for attachment to fuselage.  I have a plan for this attachment: 

 

 

Trim tab and push rod:

 

 

Balance tab (have not modelled the push rod yet):

 

 

Bumps on the bottom (low hinge axis required these on the real ailerons).  These little plates will be separate parts:

 

 

I sure hope these things fit the wing well.  I took alot of time and effort to try to duplicate the wing and planform contour locally for the Rhino model.  

 

Now to make the files for each individual part, and get somebody to print these up.   My normal supplier is out of action for a while (don't know how long), so I need an alternate.  If anyone has a name let me know; meanwhile I am toying with the idea of actually purchasing a 3D print machine and begin doing parts myself (Airscale has already done this recently). 

 

I will now get back onto the wing proper I believe.  More skinning.  You should see that next post.   Take care y'all!     

Edited May 25 by JayW

[JayW]

Corsair enthusiasts - how many of you have seen this picture.  I had not - it's awesome!  

 

 

Bougainville.  Looks like they are working on the prop governor?  

[TAG]

Honestly, I think getting your own 3D printer is total no-brainer, Jay. For the kind of modeling that guys like you and Peter do it is a complete game-changer, if you factor in your next level scratchbuilding skills with the already impressive CAD skills you've recently picked up, having your own 3D printer will literally allow you to build anything you want. Heck, if you got a large enough printer you could print entire fuselage halves and wings in 1/18 scale!

 

This guy has a YT channel almost entirely dedicated to 3D printing, and he certainly seems to know his way around, there are reviews, tips, etc. Definitely worth a gander, maybe you can find something that works for you by watching his videos? Again, I think this could unlock a whole new level of potential projects for you, much to our -the peanut gallery- delight.

[Kaeone57]

On 5/25/2023 at 5:52 PM, JayW said:

Corsair enthusiasts - how many of you have seen this picture.  I had not - it's awesome!  

 

 

Bougainville.  Looks like they are working on the prop governor?  

About a thousand times!!! LoL My favorite part about that pic is the replacement patch in natural metal behind the cowl flaps and the fact that "She" might be a 3/4 toner! LoL

 

Alfonso 

Edited June 7 by Kaeone57
Added some details

[Kaeone57]

On 5/13/2023 at 3:31 PM, JayW said:

Ordinarily I would get some more done before posting - but I am pretty pleased with this and want to show it.  Not perfect but this gun port detail does a very good job of duplicating the real thing IMO.

 

Last I posted on the gun muzzles I stated that I had erred by bonding on the gun muzzle plate before making and installing the aluminum skin - and indeed that was true.  So off I went making a very labor intensive leading edge skin panel:

 

 

Those three large cutouts are supposed to closely match the plates that surround the gun ports.  Or actually - vice-versa.  The cutouts are made first, and then the plates trimmed to match the cutouts.  The plate on the left is the one I made last post - it popped off.  That panel has upwards of one million rivet marks.  Recall that on the fuselage and center section I was largely spared many rivet rows due the fact that Vought used spot welding for field fastening extensively on skin panels.  And the spot welds are largely invisible so I did not attempt to depict them.  Not so on the outboard wing.  The outboard wing was manufactured by a supplier, which for whatever reason chose not to use spot welding.  Man- I have my work cut out for me on these wing skins, pushing all those little impressions for rivet heads.  Now I am glad a good portion of the wings' surface area is fabric covered! 

 

That panel installed, and three gun muzzle plates:

 

 

 

That skin did not want to lay down very well.  Not sure why, as the wing is single curvature...  A close-up of the openings for the 50's:

 

 

 

Rat-a-tat-tat!  The trained eye will notice they are a bit off-center.  My bad.  But I am going to live with it, try to do better on the other wing.  Also, the overall orientation to the wing leading edge highlight is not quite right, but I challenge anyone other than Alfonso to claim they noticed!  All period photos of Corsairs in fighting units show alot of tape marks around these muzzles, if not taped entirely ready to go.  I wonder how I might reproduce that (tape marks; I do not plan to cover these holes).  Accepting ideas. 

 

On to the other wing, same task.  It is difficult work to get just right.  Thanks for looking in.  

 

 

 

  

Nobody is going to know the difference anyways Bro! I only mentioned it out of the LOVE for the Corsair and for your attention to get it right. You can paint it in RLM whatever and no one will know! LoL

 

Just clowning Bro...Great Job on this... REALLY GREAT JOB!!!

 

Alfonso