1/18 Scale Blue Box F4U-1A Corsair Modification

[Warbird Kid]

Simply amazing and inspiring work! Just a thrill to open up the forum and see an update!

[daHeld]

The Seat support structure looks so cool, Jay.

Paper is probably a good choice to simulate a seat harness, especially in the big scales.

[Woody V]

23 hours ago, JayW said:

I glued/bonded, CA'd it on there really well, but still must be careful.

 

I know it's too late for this one, but a metal "pin" just about guarantees things like this won't break off.

A commonly used technique kit bashing resin figures.

[JayW]

16 minutes ago, Woody V said:

I know it's too late for this one, but a metal "pin" just about guarantees things like this won't break off.

 

Actually Woody - it is pinned on there as well.  I neglected to mention that in the original post.  Not a metal pin; it's plastic.  But it's thick!  Call it a post, not a pin.  So yes we are on the same page.  Thanks.  

[JayW]

Folks - I have an interesting development on my metallic panel tape pull testing.  

 

I made six panels as follows:

 

1.  Soft annealed alum panel with Tamiya X-22 clear acrylic base coat, white Tamiya AS-20 top coat

2.  Soft annealed alum panel with Duplicolor self-etching primer base coat, white AS-20 top coat

3.  Soft annealed alum panel with Rustoleum self-etching primer, white AS-20 top coat

4.  Heat treated litho alum panel with Tamiya X-22 clear acrylic base coat, white AS-20 top coat

5.  Heat treated litho alum panel with Duplicolor self-etching primer base coat, white AS-20 top coat

6.  Heat treated litho alum panel with Rustoleum self-etching primer, white AS-20 top coat

 

Both the Duplicolor and Rustoleum etching primers were applied with rattle can.  The X-22 clear and AS-20 white (both Tamiya) were airbrushed.  I used the stickiest masking tape I have.  The panels were sanded with 400 grit sand paper, and them meticulously cleaned with isopropyl alcohol.  Primers had just short of 24 hours to cure.    

 

I really gave the X-22 clear acrylic no chance; just did it for Chuck Sawyer's sake since he stated to me he felt it sticks well to metallic surfaces in his experience.  After all - it doesn't "etch" into the metal like an etching primer is supposed to do. 

 

And to my surprise, the X-22 performed as well or better than either of the etching primers.  I labelled the backs of the panels, so I didn't know what was what when doing the pull testing.  Only one panel had any appreciable paint lifting - the soft annealed panel with Rustoleum primer.  The other primed panels, all of them, either did not have any lifting at all, or lifted just a bit on the edges.  And the X-22 panels - not a hint of paint lifting.  Wha?????  

 

So now, what am I gonna do?  Should I trust the test?  That ugly paint lifting I got on the forward fuselage was on panels with etching primer.  So what have I got to lose?   Keeping in mind that if there is going to be any more paint lifting, it is going to be here when I do the stars and bars insignia masks on the sides.

 

Any comments?  

 

 

Edited March 21, 2023 by JayW

[LSP_Kevin]

5 hours ago, JayW said:

Any comments?  

 

 

 

I can't really offer you any useful advice, Jay, other than go with whatever your testing has proved works. If you think about it, primers need to perform two functions at the same time: stick well to the surface they're applied to, and allow other paints to stick well to them. I get a sense that many of these etching primers only do the first job properly, but don't provide the necessary surface to allow ordinary paints to bond to them. I freely admit that I could be wrong however, and would be curious to hear if the lifting you witnessed was just the top layer of paint, or went all the way down to the metal.

 

Kev

[JayW]

4 hours ago, LSP_Kevin said:

and would be curious to hear if the lifting you witnessed was just the top layer of paint, or went all the way down to the metal.

 

 

Kev- on this model, everything came off (but only locally if you recall).  So it was the primer-to-metal bond that failed.  It is very possible that I was not careful enough cleaning it though, when I was prepping the surfaces.  At any rate, I am giving the X-22 a go.  Am very nervous about it.....

[JayW]

OK - time to face facts. 

 

Fact 1 -  I have a paint lifting problem on the forward fuselage, along the sides on the furthest aft edge, both LH and RH sides.  It occurred while masking for the "17' numerals, months ago you will recall.  And I don't really know why it happened.  It's repaired, but the repair is more fragile than the surrounding undamaged paint.  It cannot be touched.

 

Fact 2 - I split the fuselage in two a couple years ago, to split up the mountain of work. 

 

Fact 3 - I fully painted and weathered the forward half of the fuselage before I even started on the mid/aft fuselage. 

 

This all leaves me with a couple of challenges.  How do I minimize the chances of paint lifting on the mid/aft fuselage while masking for the remainder of the "17" numerals, and the large US star insignias on either side?  And, how do I get a good color, transition, and weathering match between the forward and mid fuselage at the join?

 

As I reported last post, I did six test panels to test for paint lifting again, and found, amazingly, that a base layer of Tamiya X-22 clear seemed to provide a more robust stick to bare aluminum than the self-etching primers I have just for the purpose.   Thanks Chuck, it was your suggestion, but wait!  Maybe I should not hand out thanks just yet.  Also I am making more extensive usage of rubber gloves to minimize the odds of contaminating the surfaces that will see masking.

 

So I committed to X-22 clear lacquer for the base coat.  That was step one.  Easy enough, except it's clear and gloss, and it is very tough to tell how it is laying down on the aluminum surfaces because you cannot see it!!  No pics.

 

Step two was hairspraying areas where I want chipping - basically the empennage leading edges.  Easy enough.  No pics.

 

Step three was a full coverage of YZC.  Probably didn't need full coverage; it's only needed where chipping and scratches will be.  Oh well.  A picture:

 

 

 

To my surprise and disappointment, some of the formed panels show where the forming took place - just kneading with a long brass tube on a mouse pad get the panel detail to have a curve.  I am hoping as the paint scheme is applied and the star insignia, and heavy weathering, that it will be unnoticeable. 

 

Step four was the second application of hairspray, mostly on the empennage leading edges, again.  No pics.

 

Step five was top coats!   First the insignia white, second the medium blue, and third the darker Navy blue.  The real challenge here was to try to match the forward fuselage without masking.  Here:

 

    

 

 

What do you think?  I think I was able to successfully match up the transitions.  Pleased about that!  We are going to have to wait on the color matching - the weathering is the difference so far.  It really changed the tones on the forward fuselage.  I must somehow duplicate it.

 

A couple more pics of my work today:

 

  

 

 

Probably should have cleaned up my garage work bench a bit more.  Ugg.

 

 

Step six is stencils.  That is the biggest deal here, and the one that has me chewing my fingernails.  The X-22 has to work for me.  Has to.  Next post you should see those results, good or bad, plus maybe step seven - chipping and scratching.

 

Take care!

 

 

Edited March 23, 2023 by JayW

[Citadelgrad]

Don't sweat the oilcanning/forming remnants, remember, the real thing has panels that are bent, pressed, English wheeled, etc into shape.

 

It's not noticeable in the photos you posted.  

[Woody V]

11 hours ago, JayW said:

How do I minimize the chances of paint lifting on the mid/aft fuselage while masking for the remainder of the "17" numerals, and the large US star insignias on either side? 

 

I understand that some modelers would rather go blind that use decals, but I ran into an ugly problem on a recent build where the surface details created a problem where masks simply would not conform, so in desperation I made decals with the masks and not only did it solve my problem, it eliminated any chance of lifting paint, and I wouldn't think twice about using the method again. 

 

For what it's worth, here's how it works:
https://www.scalemodelpaintmasks.com/index.php?/topic/611-how-to-make-decals-with-masks/

Edited March 24, 2023 by Woody V

[Oldbaldguy]

Didn’t you tell us at one point that you didn’t know how to use an airbrush?  My, how times have changed.  And the front end of these things usually were nastier than the back ends, so you have that going for you.

[JayW]

8 hours ago, Woody V said:

For what it's worth, here's how it works:
https://www.scalemodelpaintmasks.com/index.php?/topic/611-how-to-make-decals-with-masks/

 

Wow Woody!  What a result!  For me, I have low confidence I could get as good a result.  But the great thing about it is that there is no risk of ruining the painted finish.  I will think on this.  At the same time, I did a tape pull test this morning on the side of the fuselage with no lifting.  So, so far so good.  I'll have to decide soon what to do.

[Citadelgrad]

Spitballing, Jay, but can you try some real stencil, not a mask with adhesive but a stencil held against the skin?  Seems like the area is flat enough?  You'd need at least 3 hands, but maybe it will work?

[MikeMaben]

20 hours ago, Woody V said:

For what it's worth, here's how it works:

https://www.scalemodelpaintmasks.com/index.php?/topic/611-how-to-make-decals-with-masks/

 

Great minds think alike  https://forum.largescaleplanes.com/index.php?/topic/74817-revelamiyastang/&do=findComment&comment=1091438

 

https://forum.largescaleplanes.com/index.php?/topic/95713-pcm-hurricane-mini-wip/

 

 

[Woody V]

4 hours ago, MikeMaben said:

Great minds think alike

 

Yup, solving problems is part of the fun and finding new ways to do things is even funner.