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1/18 Scale Blue Box F4U-1A Corsair Modification


JayW

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Congratulations Jay - you have reduced me to a gibbering wreck...

 

those cowl flap mechanisms are just unbelievable quality - so uniform and clean. I have said before about how I cheat by designing bits like that in PE and then proudly building up little kits of parts, but to make them from nothing and make them look like factory parts like that is an unbelievable talent

 

glad  the decals finally arrived - they look great in place

 

Peter

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On a completely unrelated subject - early Corsairs seemed to have fuel leakage problems from the fuselage tank bay.  I don't get it and would love to have it explained further.  At any rate, crews in the field would apply some sort of white tape to the skin panel joints above the fuel tank to keep it under control.  Corsair lovers know this well.

 

Here is Kepford's #29 which shows this tape application:

 

  C94Uzmjl.jpg

 

Note the aircraft behind it does not have the tape applied.  Period pictures of Corsairs show various levels of tape application - many with strips missing. So I think that tape would loosen in the airstream, get ripped off, and then get re-applied later.

 

I got some Tamiya 3mm masking tape just for this purpose.  Here I have applied it:

 

2DYHrn6h.jpg

 

 

Imgur "huge thumbnail" for you.  I would of course dirty this up some before I called it done.  But I am not 100% satisfied.

 

So I seek advise.  This stuff is a stretchy vinyl material of some sort.  It comes off a bit too easily for my taste, but that may improve with a coat of semi-gloss or flat clear over it.  It's also a bit thick - about 0.004 inch.  Scale that up by 18 and you get 0.07 inch - which is like a thick piece of sheet metal.  

 

I wonder if there is a better option.  Paint?  No.  That will not hide the skin butt joints, which must be hidden.   A decal?  Same problem I think.  That is unless I putty over the skin joints - an idea best done before I painted this thing!

 

Those of you who have built Corsair models where you did these taped over joints - what did you do?    

 

 

 

Edited by JayW
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Those cowl flaps are just staggering to look at!  And I fully agree that the skull/crossbones is much better as a decal than a paint stencil! My Corsair did not have the tape around the fuel tank except maybe a small vertical strip just in front of the windscreen, starboard side, which I represented as a painted stripe.  Unless there are photos to show otherwise, I don't assume that tape completely hid the panel lines so paint or decals would work acceptably in my mind.  

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I wonder if this stuff was hunnert mile an hour tape or was it readily available fabric tape that was glued/doped to the airplane’s skin?  Wouldn’t make much difference either way for you because they would be about the same thickness once applied, but it would be nice to know because the two would not wear/weather the same way.  And was it used to keep the gas in or rainwater and such out?  More than one airplane has crashed because water leakedinto in the fuel.

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19 hours ago, Oldbaldguy said:

 And was it used to keep the gas in or rainwater and such out?  More than one airplane has crashed because water leakedinto in the fuel.

 

Well OBG - there was a rubber bladder inside that big compartment - that I know.  Except in and around the fuel filler cap, I don't see how anything could get in, or out.  No tape at the cap.  And that is what perplexes me about why this tape was used.  This from Historynet.com:

 

  "Among the many problems that turned up in operational F4U-1 Corsairs was a leaky fuel tank, which was located between the pilot and the engine for the most favorable center of gravity. Corsair pilots I spoke to said that a virtually universal practice to keep the windshield clean was to seal the fuselage panels with strips of white tape. The oil on the cowling flaps also leaked, spattering the windshield and also affecting visibility, hence the upper cowling gills were fixed shut and they were eliminated entirely on later models."

 

22 hours ago, Thunnus said:

Unless there are photos to show otherwise, I don't assume that tape completely hid the panel lines so paint or decals would work acceptably in my mind.  

 

John - period photos I have seen seem to indicate to me that the seams do not show through much if at all.  Actually the tape I am using allows just a bit of a depression where the seams are especially if I pull it tight a bit.  I like the tape - just wish it was a bit thinner.  My masking tape is thinner, but I have no confidence I could cut the masking tape accurately enough to look the part.  I may try it though.

 

22 hours ago, Citadelgrad said:

what if you used some tape to make a negative mask, leaving the "tape" area open, and hit it with a few coats of Mr Surfacer as thick as you need, then some grungy white?   

 

Bill - interesting idea, but a very difficult masking job!  Pretty sure I am going to use some sort of tape just like they did with the actual aircraft.  Thanks.

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Am guessing it's the same venturi effect that caused fuel to siphon out of the refueling probe of the Prowler, and why you see the area gunked up with sealant. i.e. enough airflow over it creates suction and causes the fuel to seep out. A layer of tape seems like a quick an expedient way to solve the issue.

 

Agree with OBG--specialized tape. Also the same stuff they used to cover the gun ports. Nowadays it's "ordnance tape," "Speed tape" or "400 mph tape" or any such nomenclature. I think each service has their own name, but it's really just heavy duty duct tape that OD green.

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If the “tape” is there to prevent a gas from seeping/leaking out, how did they get it to stick to an already dirty surface once the adhesive comes in contact with 100+ octane avgas that is documented as hot enough to strip paint?  And if the tank were leaking enough for it to be an issue for the pilot, wouldn’t the mechs just fix the tank?  I agree with Jay: Something  about this doesn’t add up.  Sadly, none of the guys who put the stuff on are around to tell us exactly why they did it.

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19 hours ago, easixpedro said:

Am guessing it's the same venturi effect that caused fuel to siphon out of the refueling probe of the Prowler, and why you see the area gunked up with sealant. i.e. enough airflow over it creates suction and causes the fuel to seep out. A layer of tape seems like a quick an expedient way to solve the issue.

 

 

14 hours ago, Oldbaldguy said:

And if the tank were leaking enough for it to be an issue for the pilot, wouldn’t the mechs just fix the tank?  I agree with Jay: Something  about this doesn’t add up.

 

Could be if we searched the web long enough we would get better answers.  I jumped onto Aircorps library to study up a bit on the fuel system, and found that the fuel cells received one engineering change after another right from the beginning.  Obviously they were a persistent problem, up until the -D model where it seems to have settled down.  I didn't go far enough to see if I could detect just what changed when, as the "bag's" were purchased items from Goodyear and other sources, so details as to the changes are probably not obvious.  Also, the fuel cell (or "bag" as it is called on the drawings) is self-sealing just like all fuel cells in US aircraft in WW2.  But it is just chalk full of potential leak points not the least of which are hanger hooks along the sides.  That in addition to penetrations for supply lines to the pump, and vent lines.  

 

15 hours ago, airscale said:

I have a great way to solve the tape problem...

 

..don't put any on :ph34r:

 

Wait wait!  OK Peter.  I'll give you this - Corsair units were all over the map on this one, as period photos will show.  Some aircraft had taped over skin joints; some didn't.  And most of all they had evidence of taped over skin joints where the tape was gone.  Either all of it or strips of it leaving other strips there.  I have several shots of Hedrick's #17, and all show at least some taping.  Also there is evidence of repeated taping where tape is applied over residue from previous taping.   So I am going to have tape on this replica; just not sure yet how I will do it.

 

Which brings me to the subject of authenticity again.  We have already had discussions about which aircraft had what as time went by and changes were made.  And i have made some changes to improve this model's authenticity.  But I keep finding little issues with what I am doing.  Recall I had decided to include the tail hook on this aircraft based on a mission where VF-17 Corsairs, although land based, landed and took off from a task force carrier and therefore had their carrier operations equipment (the tail hook at least) re-installed on their aircraft after it had been removed.  Well that mission was one of the first VF-17 performed, and at that time Hedrick did not have the impressive scoreboard that is shown in later photos.  And from what I can tell from that unit's history, it was the only mission the Jolly Rogers took part in where they landed or took off from a carrier.  So if I want that scoreboard, I should leave off that beautiful tail hook I had 3D printed.  :unsure:  Or, if I want the tail hook, I need to cut off most of the rising suns from my scoreboard decals!  Have not decided on that yet. 

 

Also - this has been disturbing me for a while now - it appears that Jolly Rogers Corsairs did not have treaded tires nor did any early F4U-1A aircraft.  Instead they were treadless (bald).   The later appearance of treaded tires like the ones I had 3D printed are seen on carrier based -D models for the most part.  I have to tell you - I am in love with my diamond tread tires.  They came out so well.  But they are sadly inauthentic.  It would be easy for me to go into the Rhino model, delete out the tread features, and order new 3D printed tires.  It's only money.  But it would be more than that.  My wheels are permanently bonded to my tires, and would be destroyed trying to pry them out.  So I would have to re-order the 3D printed wheels halves as well, and redo all that.   Those parts were problematical - trimming the sprues from them resulted in fractures of the thin gaged spokes, tough to repair.  I do not wish to repeat that hair-raising experience.  I am soooo tempted to just stay with the diamond tread tires.... but I am accepting opinions from my audience, whose opinions I value.

 

rx6CBhjl.jpg

 

Work continues on the cowl flaps - will post results within a week I hope.   

 

 

  

Edited by JayW
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Hi Jay,

 

FWIW, I would leave the tape off and keep the treaded tires for the following reasons:

 

- Your detail on this aircraft is second to none and common to most Corsairs.  The existence of tape and smooth tires is not.  Only you and maybe one other person on this earth will know that it exists on your subject, and even that isn’t 100% of the time, so why bother?

 

- The tape will always be a problem.  The Tamiya vinyl tape is too thick (I have some) and too perfect.  The real deal is haphazard in application for obvious reasons, which is super hard to replicate.  Having said that, if you insists on using tape, I’d paint them on, so that you can control this haphazard look.  A few coats of flat white enamel which is thicker than the lacquer you are using should do the trick.

 

- The tires look terrific!  It would be a shame to get rid of them.

 

At the risk of saying an overused expression hated by some, “Less is more” in my opinion.

 

Cheers,

Chuck

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