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Alain Gadbois

Notre-Dame de Paris engulfed in flames

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1 minute ago, Trak-Tor said:

So very sad...

They say that the structure is safe now and shouldn't collapse.
The rebuild will take decades, I'm afraid. If it's possible at all. And it won't be the same place again anyway...

 

You're right that it won't be the same building, but I would be surprised if this project does not move forward quickly.

 

I think French national pride will try to get the work done as quickly as possible. 

 

It will certainly not be a quick, easy job however!

 

 

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Q: Should they rebuild it in wood? Considering the structure was about 900 yrs old, I don't know if they can find wood of either size or quality of what they had. If I was on the design team, I would probably suggest keeping the main members wood, possibly glulams to make the sizes more manageable, with non-combustible roof substructure. Heavy timber construction actually makes a good fire-resistance structure as once it chars, it helps insulate the interior of the beam. Steel can melt. But it all depends on how historically correct they want to be. It would be really interesting to be on that team. I was the project manager, on the construction side, for a Catholic church locally that was built in the historic, cruciform style, with heavy concrete. Was very interesting, and took some awards, actually. So sad it had to happen, but fire is always a danger in those old buildings.

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Posted (edited)

Here is a section of the cathedral. The 2 red arrows show in a simplified way the wooden structure that burned away. When this roof collapsed, there was fire continuing above the vault, marked in red lines, caused by the remaining wood burning on top of it.

I could not distinguish flames from inside so I guess most of the stone vault survived the intense heat and kept the flames at least out. I am waiting for more up to date info to see what damage actually occurred in the interior.

 

Image from l'Encyclopédie Médiévale de Violet Leduc.

 

CKhxhnL.jpg

Edited by Alain Gadbois

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21 minutes ago, Alain Gadbois said:

Ray, I imagine the plan would be to rebuild using the original techniques and materials, even if finding the wood required might be difficult.

 

Alain

I would be shocked if they rebuilt it using steel or other modern materials, particularly for visible components.

 

They may combine modern technology with the old in some capacity, however.  I can see some type of fire detection/repression system perhaps being implemented along with the traditional engineering and materials. 

 

I'm thinking of the massive renovation project in the Sistine Chapel.  That included installing a modern air conditioning system so that the cyclical air flow processes that lead to the deterioration of the frescos on the ceiling would not repeat.

 

I'm really curious to see what condition the organ and pipes are in.  I assume it's all destroyed beyond repair.  Replacing that alone will be a massive job.

 

 

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This is a tragedy.  Notre Dame is one of the most iconic buildings in the world.  My condolences to the French people.  I hope it is rebuilt as faithfully as is possible, but it will take time.

 

Michael

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Well, money has started to be pledged! Francois-Henri Pinault has pledged about $113 million to the restoration! That should be a great start!

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5 hours ago, Alain Gadbois said:

Ray, I imagine the plan would be to rebuild using the original techniques and materials, even if finding the wood required might be difficult.

 

Alain

You are probably right. I was just thinking most of the wood that burned is out of sight, so maybe that is where they could use non-combustible construction. Or maybe just add fire sprinklers!

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Posted (edited)

Hats off to the firemen!  Once again.
I was expecting total destruction, I must say.
It seems most of the interior was "saved".

Although part of the roof collapsed.
And two main towers stand still as well.

4145296_1000x.jpeg

 

4145291_1000x.jpeg

 

Still there is a lot of work ahead.
The structure at the top might be damaged from the extreme heat and pressure.
So even taking it all apart and rebuilding it from scratch might be an option.
We will see...

 

:hmmm:

 

 

Edited by Trak-Tor

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From BBC:

 

Billionaire François-Henri Pinault, chairman and CEO of the Kering group that owns the Gucci and Yves Saint Laurent fashion brands, pledged €100m (£86m; $113m) towards rebuilding Notre-Dame, AFP news agency reports.

 

Another €200m was pledged by Bernard Arnault's family and their company LVMH - a business empire which includes Louis Vuitton and Sephora - on Tuesday morning, according to Reuters news agency.

 

The French charity Fondation du Patrimoine is launching an international appeal for funds for the cathedral, a Unesco World Heritage site.

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The Paris fire service certainly did a great job and France can be proud of them. As for rebuilding in 5 years, that sounds ambitious but who knows. Full restoration is really the only way and where you get 13,000 oak trees from at short notice, I don't know! Bon chance!

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Posted (edited)

Wow all this money pledged for a religious building when people are starving and living on the streets. Make me proud to be human at times. Especially when the owner religion of the church aint exactly short of cash itself

Edited by AlanG

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26 minutes ago, AlanG said:

Wow all this money pledged for a religious building when people are starving and living on the streets. Make me proud to be human at times. Especially when the owner religion of the church aint exactly short of cash itself

 

 

Lets not go there please. I wont go into my own beliefs but save it to say , this isnt about religion, its about saving a piece of human history. Not many things existing today have material that was around 8 centuries ago. Its a stunningly beautiful piece of architecture and nearly the 8th wonder of the world with its size, age and beauty. 

 

Any building that old, with that much of a connection to human history deserves to be saved regardless of its original purpose.  

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Brian. Please believe me when i say that this was no way intended to have a pop at anyone's belief or non-belief in  religion. And i totally agree it was/is a beautiful building of great importance. I just find the money pledged a bit sickening given the size of the owners bank account(s).

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26 minutes ago, AlanG said:

Wow all this money pledged for a religious building when people are starving and living on the streets. Make me proud to be human at times. Especially when the owner religion of the church aint exactly short of cash itself

Totally agree with out2gtcha and I will add that since 1789 the monument is the property of the state, not the catholic church. Additionally it is also responsible for the maintenance of the structure so Rome is not paying for this.

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