vince14 Posted January 31, 2019 Share Posted January 31, 2019 1 hour ago, Eagle Driver said: Shame. They should be the first to get the newest toys if you ask me. If you ask me, they should be the last to get the newest toys. Operational requirements should always have a higher precedent than showboating. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LSP_K2 Posted January 31, 2019 Share Posted January 31, 2019 1 hour ago, vince14 said: If you ask me, they should be the last to get the newest toys. Operational requirements should always have a higher precedent than showboating. Used as a recruitment tool, why would they want to use old equipment, as that older equipment no longer now represents current front-line fighter aircraft. While they do use the Hornets as a recruitment tool, all of the Blue Angels Hornets can be turned around for front-line service, very quickly. Eagle Driver 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alaninaustria Posted January 31, 2019 Share Posted January 31, 2019 12 hours ago, Eagle Driver said: The first thing that came into my mind was: The most respected demo team, the Blue Angels, flying Hornet that is not in use with the NAVY? Because as far as I know they will fly it for two more years. Why? So tight budgets? Come on! Same in Canada with the Canadair Tutor jets... Snowbirds fly them but no more operational machines at squadron level... Cheers Alan Jack and Eagle Driver 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juggernut Posted January 31, 2019 Share Posted January 31, 2019 FWIW.... I'm unsure about the specifics regarding the Blue Angels but I do know that the USAF Thunderbirds fly aircraft that can be made combat ready in a short while (as in hour(s)). They fly what's in the inventory. If the Blue Angels operate the same way (and it appears they may not), they'd have current equipment that can be made combat ready in a short time as well. So, when the NAVY retires the legacy Hornet, they may get the F/A-18E's and F's. I've never seen the Blue Angels fly anything older than A-4's at a time when the premier combat aircraft in the US Navy was the F-14A Tomcat. I think they flew the F-4 Phantom II before the A-4 which would've been awesome to watch that Goliath twist and turn around the sky. LSP_K2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Williams Posted February 1, 2019 Share Posted February 1, 2019 I wouldn’t be surprised to see the BA keep the Hornet for a while. Most people don’t really know the difference between the legacy Hornet and Super Hornet, so it wouldn’t be as obvious that they were flying an aircraft that’s being phased out. Plus, there would be less of a need to keep them combat ready, and they might be cheaper to operate as spare parts can be obtained from retired aircraft. Alain Gadbois 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kagemusha Posted February 1, 2019 Share Posted February 1, 2019 Would be good to see the Blue Angels fly the Hawk, oops, sorry, Goshawk, irregardless, would be great to see one In 1/32. Eagle Driver and MikeC 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juggernut Posted February 1, 2019 Share Posted February 1, 2019 The maintenance costs associated with the legacy hornets would probably, and it might be sooner than later, exceed their budget allowances if they flew the legacy hornet while the rest of the fleet was flying Super Hornets. Maintenance is extremely costly and I'm not sure of the ratio in the Navy, but I'll bet it's more than a 5:1 maintenance to flight hour ratio. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John1 Posted February 1, 2019 Share Posted February 1, 2019 (edited) 3 hours ago, Juggernut said: FWIW.... I'm unsure about the specifics regarding the Blue Angels but I do know that the USAF Thunderbirds fly aircraft that can be made combat ready in a short while (as in hour(s)). I’ve read in a few articles that’s a PR myth and it would take considerably longer (weeks) to get the jets (in either service) back to combat status. Personally, I’m fine with the Blues flying older jets. I know a few mechanics in the SH community and they are saying most non-deployed squadrons on a good day might have 4 operational jets, on other days, maybe half that number. Why on earth would we take new build jets and give them to the Blues when the tactical squadrons are in such horrible shape? Edited February 1, 2019 by John1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagle Driver Posted February 1, 2019 Author Share Posted February 1, 2019 The idea of the Blue Angels and Thunderbirds is to recruit, not to entertain. F-35 is most appropriate. But I believe the money are the issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Hegedus Posted February 3, 2019 Share Posted February 3, 2019 (edited) On 1/31/2019 at 10:17 PM, John1 said: I’ve read in a few articles that’s a PR myth and it would take considerably longer (weeks) to get the jets (in either service) back to combat status. Personally, I’m fine with the Blues flying older jets. I know a few mechanics in the SH community and they are saying most non-deployed squadrons on a good day might have 4 operational jets, on other days, maybe half that number. Why on earth would we take new build jets and give them to the Blues when the tactical squadrons are in such horrible shape? Considering that the Blue Angels have been flying pretty much the oldest, most crapped-out Hornets that the Navy has/had, it would take quite a bit to get them "combat-ready". And honestly, if it got to the point where they had to send the Blue Angels and thier jets into combat, we're pretty much screwed up one side and down the other...'cause those jets are pretty much the bottom of the barrel - no trap life left, non-standard equipment fit, generally worn-out airplanes. It's not likely to change when they transition, either. They'll most likely get the oldest Super Hornets out there, that have equipment fits that are incompatible with front-line needs (read: old lot test jets and FRS airplanes) They may have priority for spare parts to meet the show schedule, but the guys on the pointy end have priority for the most capable weapons system. The Thunderbirds fly much more up-to-date jets, and as such would probably be able to transiton to "combat-ready" much quicker. They ran an excercise in 2013 where they took the show jets, and did the "make it ready to shoot" refit and sent them out to bomb a range, still painted in the show schemes. There's pics out there somewhere of it - one of them shows the right wing and tail of one of the jets, with an empty inboard pylon, middle pylon with a high-speed TER and 3 MK-82 ballute bombs, and an AIM-9 on the outboard pylon. Another one taken of one of the jets in flight, from below, shows there is also an ECM pod on the centerline, and the left wing is loaded symmetrically to the right. It also shows that the wingtips had AIM-9s as well, and they appear to be AIM-9P missiles Still, we're likely in a serious world of hurt if it actually became necessary to do that, though. Edited February 3, 2019 by Joe Hegedus Eagle Driver 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vince14 Posted February 3, 2019 Share Posted February 3, 2019 On 2/1/2019 at 6:19 AM, Eagle Driver said: The idea of the Blue Angels and Thunderbirds is to recruit, not to entertain. F-35 is most appropriate. But I believe the money are the issue. Is there any proof that the Blue Angels (or indeed any military aerobatic team) are successful as a recruitment tool, though? How many people join the Navy purely because they saw the Blue Angels in flight? Don't get me wrong, I think aerobatic teams are a nice thing to have. But I'm not convinced that anyone has ever walked into a recruitment centre and signed up purely because they saw some aircraft flying in close formation. In fact, isn't the movie Top Gun often quoted as the best recruitment tool the Navy ever had? Eagle Driver and John1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John1 Posted February 3, 2019 Share Posted February 3, 2019 7 hours ago, vince14 said: Is there any proof that the Blue Angels (or indeed any military aerobatic team) are successful as a recruitment tool, though? How many people join the Navy purely because they saw the Blue Angels in flight? Don't get me wrong, I think aerobatic teams are a nice thing to have. But I'm not convinced that anyone has ever walked into a recruitment centre and signed up purely because they saw some aircraft flying in close formation. In fact, isn't the movie Top Gun often quoted as the best recruitment tool the Navy ever had? These teams are definitely "nice to have" but at a time when line units aren't even close to combat ready due to lack of parts and personnel, I'd argue that they are an unnecessary drain on resources and as noted above, I'd also guess that their value as a recruiting tool is vastly over-rated. I saw the Blues and T-birds multiple times as a kid and not once did I ever think - "Wow, that's is so cool I think I'll run down to the recruiter's office and sign up (instead I joined the Army ). I know it will be regarded as sacrilege but I'd suggest scrapping one of the teams and simply going with a single flight demo team to represent all of the US armed forces. I really don't know how other countries with more severe budget restrictions manage it. Canada comes to mind. When the Snowbirds do a demo, that could be a sizable percentage of all flyable Canadian military jets in the air. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagle Driver Posted February 3, 2019 Author Share Posted February 3, 2019 Is today the last day for the Hornet? By the way it really bugs me when it is referred to as "Legacy" It is The Hornet. The mighty Hornet that was one of my first aviation love affairs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John1 Posted February 3, 2019 Share Posted February 3, 2019 11 minutes ago, Eagle Driver said: Is today the last day for the Hornet? By the way it really bugs me when it is referred to as "Legacy" It is The Hornet. The mighty Hornet that was one of my first aviation love affairs. Last day for USN flight ops was 2/1. https://defence-blog.com/news/u-s-navy-farewells-f-a-18c-hornet-aircraft.html Obviously, they will be flying for many more years with the Marines. Not sure if they'll end up on any carrier decks though... Eagle Driver 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagle Driver Posted February 3, 2019 Author Share Posted February 3, 2019 50 minutes ago, John1 said: Last day for USN flight ops was 2/1. https://defence-blog.com/news/u-s-navy-farewells-f-a-18c-hornet-aircraft.html Obviously, they will be flying for many more years with the Marines. Not sure if they'll end up on any carrier decks though... The mighty NAVY Hornet is dead. Long live the Aggressors! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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