Jerry Crandall Posted February 3, 2019 Share Posted February 3, 2019 Hello, My name is Kimbra S. and I am the office manager for Eagle Editions. Since Jerry is badly "under the weather" he asked me to share the following information with fellow enthusiasts. In the mid 1990s Jerry and Judy traveled to Germany again this time to meet with Warnecke & Böhm the leading manufacturer of paint for the Luftwaffe in WW II. They met with the management staff including the CEO, head chemist etc. Lots of interesting information came from the meeting. Here are some condensed excerpts from Jerry's Fw 190 Dora book vol. 2 . " The German war industry was dramatically altered when Dr. Pomper, head of W&B received two patents in the late 1930s. these patents were for a new formula based on an artificial resin polymer based paint. This new formula had superior adhesion to aluminum and magnesium. As a result no primer was needed as with previous standard lacquer based paints. This helped in time, money and weight plus was fade resistant. Of course RLM 45 Red Oxide was still needed for fabric. The RLM was so pleased with this new formula they directed other paint companies to use this resin, trade marked IKORAL, and pay W&B a royalty."W&B was so pleased that J&J was interested(to say the least) that they searched their old files and gave J&J everything they had from the wartime. They explained that as the Russians were approaching Berlin W&B destroyed most of their files including the late war color data. The material given included copies of Dr. Pomper's patents and all the original RLM color recipes they had. These are published in Jerry's book. RLM 66; In the original recipes there are seven 66 formulas. This is because the RLM directed W&B to develop formulas that included fire and acid resistance qualities. As a result the color was slightly altered and can be seen in late war parts to have a slight dark green cast, very evident on an Me 262 rudder pedal we have in our collection. Paint companies were told to cut back production on RLM 02 as this new 66 would replace 02 on some parts like landing gear legs. Amazing to W&B was that no researcher had visited them prior to J&J. Hope this helps, and as Jerry says, cheers, Kimbra S. LSP_Paul, LSP_Kevin, LSP_Matt and 9 others 8 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Vincent Posted February 3, 2019 Share Posted February 3, 2019 (edited) 28 minutes ago, Jerry Crandall said: RLM 66; In the original recipes there are seven 66 formulas. This is because the RLM directed W&B to develop formulas that included fire and acid resistance qualities. As a result the color was slightly altered and can be seen in late war parts to have a slight dark green cast, very evident on an Me 262 rudder pedal we have in our collection. Paint companies were told to cut back production on RLM 02 as this new 66 would replace 02 on some parts like landing gear legs. Amazing to W&B was that no researcher had visited them prior to J&J No, really ? And there are other sources of information beside W&B: The British survey contains a copy of ALL original documentation from EVERY firm involved in a/c paint production during WW2. It also contains interview transcripts, and it's in english which is more practical. And it's Ikarol, not Ikoral Edited February 3, 2019 by Vincent/MDC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark P Posted February 3, 2019 Share Posted February 3, 2019 (edited) I think a typing error, as you have suggested, generated by a girl working in the EE office can be overlooked... Mark Proulx Edited February 3, 2019 by Mark P nmayhew and anj4de 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Vincent Posted February 3, 2019 Share Posted February 3, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, Jerry Crandall said: They explained that as the Russians were approaching Berlin W&B destroyed most of their files including the late war color data. Whoever was tasked to do that did not do a good job as you find a copy of these very files in the british 1945-46 survey Edited February 3, 2019 by Vincent/MDC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Vincent Posted February 3, 2019 Share Posted February 3, 2019 (edited) 5 minutes ago, Jennings Heilig said: STOP THE PRESSES!!! NEW RESEARCH JUST UNEARTHED!!! Discuss... My good friends at B&W told me about these new colors when they gave me their secret files about 20 years ago. It basically had to do with the Luftwaffe wanting a more "socially acceptable" image. Swastika was to be replaced by a peace symbol. I have a couple of panels from a Me109K6 in my collection which show traces of these colors. You can see below a Messerschmitt painted with the revised RLM81 : Edited February 3, 2019 by Vincent/MDC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Vincent Posted February 3, 2019 Share Posted February 3, 2019 Some uniforms were also redesigned in the new colors : Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gazzas Posted February 3, 2019 Share Posted February 3, 2019 Well... If Anything, this thread has inspired me to look for Jerry Crandall's Books. However, my favorite bookseller lists all of Jerry's titles on it's site as unavailable. Anyone know a good place(s) to find them? Gaz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Vincent Posted February 3, 2019 Share Posted February 3, 2019 A surviving proto : Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Vincent Posted February 3, 2019 Share Posted February 3, 2019 20 minutes ago, Jennings Heilig said: STOP THE PRESSES!!! NEW RESEARCH JUST UNEARTHED!!! Discuss... At least the 82 is well documented : Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattlow Posted February 3, 2019 Share Posted February 3, 2019 10 minutes ago, Gazzas said: Well... If Anything, this thread has inspired me to look for Jerry Crandall's Books. However, my favorite bookseller lists all of Jerry's titles on it's site as unavailable. Anyone know a good place(s) to find them? Many of Jerry's books were at the higher end of the cost spectrum when on general release (not saying they weren't worth every £/$). Now they seem to be the domain of rather high collector prices. So keep your eyes peeled for a bargain (I have picked up Eagle Editions/Classic books in charity shops for very reasonable prices). Otherwise, hope for reprints.. Matt Gazzas 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John1 Posted February 3, 2019 Share Posted February 3, 2019 18 minutes ago, Jennings Heilig said: STOP THE PRESSES!!! NEW RESEARCH JUST UNEARTHED!!! Discuss... According to my extensive research (that I'm not inclined to share with anyone), in the closing days of the war, the RLM issued an urgent command to re-label these paints using a hyphen. The correct designation was actually RLM-XX (ie RLM-81, RLM-82, etc). You heretics need to step up your game. If you can't even use the proper designation for this paint, how can I depend on you to provide any useful information as to it's actual color / mode of application. Discuss.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Vincent Posted February 3, 2019 Share Posted February 3, 2019 16 minutes ago, Gazzas said: Well... If Anything, this thread has inspired me to look for Jerry Crandall's Books. However, my favorite bookseller lists all of Jerry's titles on it's site as unavailable. Anyone know a good place(s) to find them? Gaz Google search + 5s gives this : https://www.ebay.com/b/jerry-crandall/bn_7024804572 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Vincent Posted February 3, 2019 Share Posted February 3, 2019 Just now, John1 said: According to my extensive research (that I'm not inclined to share with anyone), in the closing days of the war, the RLM issued an urgent command to re-label these paints using a hyphen. The correct designation was actually RLM-XX (ie RLM-81, RLM-82, etc). You heretics need to step up your game. If you can't even use the proper designation for this paint, how can I depend on you to provide any useful information as to it's actual color / mode of application. Discuss.... That is total bs. Goering's daughter gave me all her dad's material after a passionate but short affair. I can assure you that the hypen is a myth introduced by the incorrect translation of the german Schulmeck dialect. It should be a +, RLM+81 etc The compositions were stolen by Ferdinand Porsche who went to build successfull cars after the war with these new formulations requiring no metal to paint on Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Vincent Posted February 3, 2019 Share Posted February 3, 2019 well, at least i got a good laugh before leaving. Thanks guys ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John1 Posted February 3, 2019 Share Posted February 3, 2019 On a serious note: Hey Vince - it's good to see you back. I'm truly glad and want you to know that the info you provide is greatly appreciated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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