Any 1/32 Me 262 on the horizon?

[Rick Griewski]

1 hour ago, VintageEagle said:

Here’s an immediate postwar measurement of the diameter:

 

https://www.pinterest.ch/pin/434808539015627619/

 

LOL.  My eyes are too old to read the measuring stick.  

[BiggTim]

19 minutes ago, Rick Griewski said:

 

Ooo you are mean guy trying to get someone to buy that old thing of a kit.  LOL!

 

Rick

I would never do that.

[Rick Griewski]

6 hours ago, VintageEagle said:

Most likely as I have seen pictures of sprues that show the single seater canopy when they released the nightfigter. I expected them to release it this year, but it will most likely be released next year or in 2020.

 

But is there any other rumor? Airfix has measured the airframe for their 1/72 kit. ZM was rumored to do a twin-engined German aircraft soon (besides the Hs 129?) and Tamiya hs not yet released any 1/32 kit for 2019.

 

Cheers 

Roger

 

I would like ZM to release a twin engine model kit in the Potez 63 family of varients.   IIRC the Germans adapted the Gnome-Rhone 14M engines and cowling for use in the Hs-129.  The Hs-129 kit could be leveraged for a Potez in this area.

 

Rick

[ringleheim]

If Tamiya ever goes back to making 1/32 aircraft again, an Me-262 would make a lot of sense.

 

I think it's a popular plane, they owe us a German plane next IMO, and Tamiya likes to kick the same subject matter around over the years in differing releases and scales.

 

They have always made ME-262s so it's not like it would be out of left field for them to make a super kit in 1/32 scale.

 

The 1/32 aircraft modeling community is really set back by Tamiya's somewhat flakey approach to 1/32 aircraft production.

 

You never know when they will do one, if at all, or when it will be released.

 

Imagine if they decided to give the "super treatment" to most key US, Japanese, German, and British aircraft of WWII, releasing a new kit every 4 months!  3 new kits a year!  Year after year....until the day comes when you can buy whatever you want, more or less, with the definitive Tamiya super-kit treatment!  

 

That would completely re-define the 1/32 market.

 

I know that would be a lot of work, but what model company has the resources of Tamiya!?  If anyone could do it, it's Tamiya. 

 

One can dream! 

 

 

 

[cbk57]

Releasing a constant stream of 1/32 kits is just not the Tamiya way.  They are a big picture toy company really with a heavy emphasis on plastic models.  They seem to pick a few major projects a year spread across several subjects, for example a big RC project or two and one or two big plastic projects.  But one might be a motorcycle and one might be a tank, then a plane or two.  They never do all armor, all cars or all planes.  They spread their work across different facets of modeling.  So no getting 3 1/32 planes a year out of them will not happen.  I hope we get one in the next three years.  

 

They might choose to do a 1/12 race car before they do another 1/32 plane.  They might do a couple more 1/16 tanks who knows what they are going to do.  There is no shortage of 1/32 planes though coming out so I am not worried.

[Ossington 1]

If only I'd known! I was at Cosford today and I had a tape measure in my bag, didn't take too many 262 pics though as I covered it on a previous visit. Does anyone live local and can pop in? The staff are wonderful and will allow such contact with their airframe.

I didn't know the Trumpeter kit had problems. No-one mentioned it on its release, all reviews rather laudatory istr. The original 70's Revell 262 was poor around the intakes, too 'coney' without the differing taper to top and bottom lines in profile. 

[VintageEagle]

OK, I took measurements on the kits as I own both. As expected, the Revell kit has larger intake diameters. In mm, it is:

 

Trumpeter: 13.6 mm

Revell: 14.5 mm

 

If I take the 20 inch diameter from the post-war report, this would give me 0.625 inch in 1/32, which is 15.88 mm. Now, that would be too large for both kits. Either both kits got it wrong or the post-war report got it wrong or refered to another diameter. 

 

This German (probalby wartime) drawing indicates a diameter of 460mm, which in 1/32 is 14.4mm:

 

http://scalemodels.ru/modules/forum/img_678875_1335372307_File0203.jpg.html

 

So, real deal is 14.4, Trumpeter is 13.6 (0.8mm or 6%) off, Revell is 14.5 (or 0.7% off, which is probalby within the measurement accuracy of my tool I used). 

 

So, D Bellis, it is not a 'perceived inaccuracy' but a measured one as suspected already by just visual comparison of the Trumpeter 1/32 kit with the Messerschmitt 1/1 original.

 

Cheers,

Roger

[LSP_K2]

I tend to think that the Trumpeter 262 kits are just fine as-is, so unless someone gives me a Revell kit (highly doubtful), I'll do just fine without it.

[Darren Howie]

There are plenty of 262’s in Museums rather than using drawings just get the real thing measured for those so inclined.

 

[D Bellis]

5 hours ago, VintageEagle said:

So, D Bellis, it is not a 'perceived inaccuracy' but a measured one as suspected already by just visual comparison of the Trumpeter 1/32 kit with the Messerschmitt 1/1 original.

Sorry, but I'm not buying into that.

 

Quote

A US post war technical analysis of the Me 262 stated that the “diameter at the intake end is 20 in.”

We have to ask ourselves the question: Is that information correct? Probably not. How can we almost instantly know this? The engine was manufactured to metric specifications, the stated measurement is a neat even number given in inches and therefore very likely a generalization at best. Further investigation reveals that “20 inches” equates to 508mm, which is much larger than the Swiss source you cited, as well as every other source I could find. So the initial 'not likely' observation proves out with very little effort.

 

Speaking of other sources…

 

The Russian images showing the results of post-war measurement of the Me 262 engine in Switzerland, and that states “460mm” for the inside of the intake lip. This makes sense for several reasons, not the least of which is the fact that the diagram shows the exact line of measurement – across the inside of the intake lip. This measurement also compares favorably with Arthur Bentley’s drawings.

 

That stated 460mm equals 14.375mm in 1/32 scale.

 

My own kits measure out to: Revell 14.1mm and Trumpeter 13.5mm. This is a difference of just .6mm between them.

 

If we accept the Swiss measurement of 460mm, then Revell’s intakes are .275mm small, and Trumpeter’s are .875mm small.

 

If you can actually see a difference of less than one millimeter across the intakes of either one of those kits, then more power to you. But, maybe a quick swipe with some sandpaper to open the holes by that minuscule amount might solve the issue for you.

 

Back to your original question: Given how well done both Trumpeter’s “A-Team” Me 262 kits and Revell’s Me 262B-1a/U1 kits are, and across a wide retail price range, there is almost zero chance that any other manufacturer would risk producing yet another 1/32 Me 262 kit.

 

Cheers,

D

[MikeMaben]

5 hours ago, VintageEagle said:

             http://scalemodels.ru/modules/forum/img_678875_1335372307_File0203.jpg.html

 

Hi Roger , those are general arrangement drawings not blueprints.

2 of the 3 show 460mm  while the 3rd shows 480mm

I wouldn't necessarily trust them for a final determination.

[VintageEagle]

OK, I carefully measured again with my calliper and I got the same dimensions as I reported before, i.e.

 

- Trumpeter 13.6mm (0.8mm or 6% too small)

- Revell 14.5 (0.1mm or 0.7% too big)

 

Total difference between the two is 6.7%. The absolute difference is not so big (0.9mm), but the relative one is quite noticeable. To illustrate this, let's take an example where we are more used to compare sizes. Compare the height of a person of 1.80m height (= ca. 5 feet, 11 inches) to one who is 6.7% smaller, i.e. 1.68m (= ca. 5 feet 6 inches). I am sure most of you would be able to tell who the smaller person is without the need to measure first.

 

Still, there may be those who don't notice the difference between the Trumpeter and Revell intake diameter (and vs. the original). Good for those as they will have two brands to chose from. Personally, I have noticed the difference ever since the Trumpeter kit came out and it has been bothering me. 

 

So, enough of that and back the the reason for my OP. I was glad when the Revell kit came out and corrected the intakes. Still, I would welcome if a company like Tamiya or Zoukei Mura was working on a high-end Me 262 kit. Tamiya has done a 1/48 scale kit and probably has all the required drawings to create an 1/32 kit. ZM has demonstrated that they are interested in late war German fighter types, although I expect them to rather do an Ar 234 than a Me 262. Still, I was hoping that there are some rumors out, but that doesn't seem to be the case. So, for 2019 I hope Revell will announce one at the Nurburg Toy Fair at the beginning of the year and maybe Tamiya or Zoukei Mura will bring one in a few years. I would be more than delighted.

 

Cheers,

 

Roger

Edited November 16, 2018 by VintageEagle

[thierry laurent]

Well,

 

We all have our favorite themes and one thing that does not annoy someone is a crime for somebody else!

 

But to me, even if I am a true nitpicker, the difference stays visually negligeable as the Trumpy kit as a correct 262 stance. The kit has correct external shapes even if not fully accurate here and there, is quite detailed and sold for a reasonably price. Just compare it with the Hasegawa or the old Revell offers... ouch! The kit does not ask for a tremendous work to get a beautiful result.

 

A picture being better than anything, just look at that comparison of pics coming from Doog's Models site:

 

 

This is just a picture but because of the engine location, the intake looks a little bit too large! So, I am not sure the problem is only linked to the intake diameter. The Jumo parts are about 10% to 50% undersized and the compressor face is at least 5mm too far forward amongst other engine issues. Personally, if the engine is going to be visible, I will cross-kit Trumpy parts with Hasegawa ones.

 

The new Revell kit will be a little bit better for (hopefully) a lower price. However, as most conversion kits have been tailored for the Trumpy kit and I do not think Revell will release a full series of 262 rare variants, this stays the best option for a recco, glass bomber or pulkzerstorer bird. Obviously, we may see new conversions but I would not hold my breath for that as it looks like such conversions were not really bestsellers. By the way, this is probably confirmed by the fact Trumpeter did not release more exotic variants whereas Hobby boss did in 1:48th  scale.

 

Last, a Tamiya kit would be beautiful but the price would be three to four times higher... So, if Tamiya releases one, I will get a kit without one second of hesitation but very frankly I would not wait for such a release to build a 262 as they do not seem to rely on any logic when one considers 1/32 planes releases... :-(

 

Cheers

 

Thierry

 

 

[VintageEagle]

Thierry,

 

thanks for your comments. The whole engine nacelle on the Trumpeter kit looks too large compared to the original on these photos, but - as you stated - it may just be due to the photos (lense and camera settings). Personally, I prefer the overall shape of the Revell kit and I do notice a difference. 

 

As I don’t bulid many kits, just a few, I personally prefer quality over price. So, I’d go for the most accurate high quality kit even if it is 5x more expensive than other brands. But that is my personal preference and I am sure and I can understand that there are probably many out there who can easily live with some inaccuracies if it comes for a lower price, more aftermarket sets or more subtypes that can be bulit. 

 

So, if Tamiya or ZM ever brings a new 262, I’ll buy a couple. But I will do the same as well if Revell brings an A-1a next year. 

 

Cheers,

Roger

Edited November 16, 2018 by VintageEagle

[Bruce_Crosby]

Hi Guys,

 

i had had a long chat with the German guy on the Revell stand at Telford and mentioned the 262 single seater.  Yes it’s coming, but I’m sworn to secrecy on the release date. But don’t spend all the money you’re going to get in your Xmas stocking!

 

Regards,

 

Bruce Crosby,