DeanKB Posted June 23, 2019 Share Posted June 23, 2019 7 hours ago, 19squadron said: - Yes - that they be as faithful a record of the original as possible. Whereas the rest of us are happy to build any old rubbish? You've proclaimed Tamiya kits as basically needing a lot of work & you've forecast, with confidence, that all existing kits will be obsolete once WNW's Lanc sees the light of day - on the back of mainly photos of an unpainted test shot - to a forum of modellers who invest lots of time & effort building these very same "obsolete" kits. You may wish to work on your bedside manner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
esarmstrong Posted June 23, 2019 Share Posted June 23, 2019 (edited) 17 hours ago, 19squadron said: I don't know why on earth you would write or think like this? - if you want it "smooth" why not just content yourself with the HK kit and simply ignore WNW's, in my view fantastic efforts? With HK you have the option of a Mkl and a Chastise Lanc. Sorted. No more worries and the kits are out now so you can build one now...... Hey, thanks for the sincere, heartfelt and most helpful advice. I've been looking at all the reviews of the HK model Lanc. Since you were kind and thoughtful enough to be the one to bring up the HK Lanc, maybe it's the choice, especially considering the mortgage I was contemplating to finance the WNW Lanc... It sure is great to live mere minutes from Chattanooga, TN, the site of this years IPMS Nationals in early August. WNW will be there, no doubt with their famous test shot in tow. I look forward to checking it out personally and seeing the thing "in the flesh". If permitted, might even ask some questions of the good folks at WNW, such as Richard Alexander, if he is there. Hopefully he (or someone there) will give answers. Some of the things I would like to know are will this model have only one (1) detailed RRM engine and three "dummy" engines and if you want four (4) you can purchase the other three (3) separately? I would also be interested to know if the kit will have any internal detail aft of the cockpit area or is this area completely devoid of detail. Edited June 23, 2019 by esarmstrong grammar and word usage error Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
esarmstrong Posted June 23, 2019 Share Posted June 23, 2019 8 hours ago, AlanG said: Bit like when people continually bang on about the WNW kit on EVERY HK thread regarding the Lancaster? No one does that on a HK model Lanc thread on this site... AlanG 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John1 Posted June 23, 2019 Share Posted June 23, 2019 7 hours ago, esarmstrong said: Hey, thanks for the sincere, heartfelt and most helpful advice. I've been looking at all the reviews of the HK model Lanc. Since you were kind and thoughtful enough to be the one to bring up the HK Lanc, maybe it's the choice, especially considering the mortgage I was contemplating to finance the WNW Lanc... If permitted, might even ask some questions of the good folks at WNW, such as Richard Alexander, if he is there. Hopefully he (or someone there) will give answers. Some of the things I would like to know are will this model have only one (1) detailed RRM engine and three "dummy" engines and if you want four (4) you can purchase the other three (3) separately? I would also be interested to know if the kit will have any internal detail aft of the cockpit area or is this area completely devoid of detail. Thought I read somewhere that it was coming with 4 complete engines. Could be wrong. Personally, as a cost reduction effort, I'd really prefer if WN were only to provide one full engine and offer others separately for those who just have to show each one exposed. Actually, since engines aren't "my thing", reduce costs even further by not including any engines and allow the individual modeler to purchase 1-4 Merlins separately, per their own whims. With regard to cost, per WN's website, they are trying to have the kit come in between $349 - $399. I'm confused by comments like yours about the mortgage needed to finance the kit. Maybe I'm an exception but I don't think $399 is a deal-breaker for an model like this (to me, the only real concern is the size of the damned thing). I see certain modelers bang out 4-5 (sometimes more) LSP kits a year, all of which probably cost ~ $100/ea (without including any aftermarket). And yet $399 for a kit that would probably keep a modeler (at one like me) busy for a year is somehow extreme? I just don't get comments like that. I understand that some folks on this site are on fixed budgets and this cost is beyond them but I'd be willing to bet that for the majority of the folks here, this cost isn't anything insurmountable. Not aimed at you specifically, just a general observation... alanash1963, Stevepd and 19squadron 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlanG Posted June 23, 2019 Share Posted June 23, 2019 (edited) 3 hours ago, John1 said: 1. I see certain modelers bang out 4-5 (sometimes more) LSP kits a year, all of which probably cost ~ $100/ea (without including any aftermarket) 2. I understand that some folks on this site are on fixed budgets and this cost is beyond them 1. My costs this year are; Revell G6 £20 ($26), Hasegawa Fw190 A8 £30 ($29), Revell Fw190 F8 £20 ($26). So no not near the $100 per kit mark. And the A8 is the only one i've built so far. The G6 is next. 2. My exact reasons for buying said kits above. Farming doesn't pay well but it's a job i totally love. I could go back into civil/military aviation engineering but i don't need the stress anymore (yes i did go to school/college/RAF and get qualifications and even have the right to have 'TECH' after my name). But that aside the above kits are great kits for modellers like myself who don't have the skills that the majority on here have. I know my limitations lol. Edited June 23, 2019 by AlanG dyslexia kicked in Stevepd 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeanKB Posted June 23, 2019 Share Posted June 23, 2019 2 hours ago, John1 said: Thought I read somewhere that it was coming with 4 complete engines. Could be wrong. Personally, as a cost reduction effort, I'd really prefer if WN were only to provide one full engine and offer others separately for those who just have to show each one exposed. Actually, since engines aren't "my thing", reduce costs even further by not including any engines and allow the individual modeler to purchase 1-4 Merlins separately, per their own whims. With regard to cost, per WN's website, they are trying to have the kit come in between $349 - $399. I'm confused by comments like yours about the mortgage needed to finance the kit. Maybe I'm an exception but I don't think $399 is a deal-breaker for an model like this (to me, the only real concern is the size of the damned thing). I see certain modelers bang out 4-5 (sometimes more) LSP kits a year, all of which probably cost ~ $100/ea (without including any aftermarket). And yet $399 for a kit that would probably keep a modeler (at one like me) busy for a year is somehow extreme? I just don't get comments like that. I understand that some folks on this site are on fixed budgets and this cost is beyond them but I'd be willing to bet that for the majority of the folks here, this cost isn't anything insurmountable. Not aimed at you specifically, just a general observation... I'd take that bet. I suspect - with no evidence whatsoever - that the majority of LSP members would not spend $400 on a single model. It's just not a sane thing to do. It's not "normal". $400 can get you 4-5 Tamiya kits, numerous Revell kits, shedloads of AM, etc. Spending that much on a single kit is just so, so far out of the ordinary. The only other kit I can think of that was comparable in price was HpH's Catalina. I know it was resin & fiberglass, but even so, it cost far more than any other kit. And that sold in small batches, made to order - very small numbers indeed. I think that the hardcore modellers who tend to post here perhaps gives us an inaccurate picture of the wider LSP modelling scene? I honestly don't know. I'm guessing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrish Posted June 23, 2019 Share Posted June 23, 2019 13 minutes ago, DeanKB said: I'd take that bet. I suspect - with no evidence whatsoever - that the majority of LSP members would not spend $400 on a single model. It's just not a sane thing to do. It's not "normal". $400 can get you 4-5 Tamiya kits, numerous Revell kits, shedloads of AM, etc. Spending that much on a single kit is just so, so far out of the ordinary. The only other kit I can think of that was comparable in price was HpH's Catalina. I know it was resin & fiberglass, but even so, it cost far more than any other kit. And that sold in small batches, made to order - very small numbers indeed. I think that the hardcore modellers who tend to post here perhaps gives us an inaccurate picture of the wider LSP modelling scene? I honestly don't know. I'm guessing. I’m not in a majority? I can’t say and won’t fathom a guess what folks spend of their “disposable income” on the hobby. When I bought my first kit over $100.00 (Canadian) it took a couple of months of saving to get it but with two little girls, a poorly paid job, car loan, mortgage, and wife in university I probably shouldn’t even have been buying models at all! Now, I’m nearing 60, great paying job, wife equal to my pay, girls off with their own families, 4 cars all paid for (none purchase new)...still got a mortgage...but a $400.00 to $500.00 kit is (to me) a fairly substantial expense but if it’s something I want it will be purchased. A friend of mine spends that on a weekend golfing and enjoys every minute and that’s only a weekend....the 4-500.00 I spend will give me enjoyment for 4-5 months....and then I can show it (or not) at shows and contests. So as far as hobby/ disposable income money spent (in my opinion) it’s not a bad price. I’m not a wealthy man, I’m an automotive mechanic doing ground support equipment maintenance for a charter air carrier. BloorwestSiR and LSP_K2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeanKB Posted June 23, 2019 Share Posted June 23, 2019 2 minutes ago, chrish said: I’m not in a majority? I can’t say and won’t fathom a guess what folks spend of their “disposable income” on the hobby. When I bought my first kit over $100.00 (Canadian) it took a couple of months of saving to get it but with two little girls, a poorly paid job, car loan, mortgage, and wife in university I probably shouldn’t even have been buying models at all! Now, I’m nearing 60, great paying job, wife equal to my pay, girls off with their own families, 4 cars all paid for (none purchase new)...still got a mortgage...but a $400.00 to $500.00 kit is (to me) a fairly substantial expense but if it’s something I want it will be purchased. A friend of mine spends that on a weekend golfing and enjoys every minute and that’s only a weekend....the 4-500.00 I spend will give me enjoyment for 4-5 months....and then I can show it (or not) at shows and contests. So as far as hobby/ disposable income money spent (in my opinion) it’s not a bad price. I’m not a wealthy man, I’m an automotive mechanic doing ground support equipment maintenance for a charter air carrier. I'm also pretty well off, and a $400 kit is not out of the question for me. However, in my Cardiff model group, I'm out on my own - by miles. And these are not poor people, they are fairly well off, but the idea of spending that much just doesn't enter their minds. I suppose the question is - how many of us are that old enough, that far along in our careers, with family moved out (or no family to begin with) & mortgages paid off, to be able to afford it? The economy seems to be whizzing along, so numbers should be higher than they've been before? But then again, I know plenty of people who are in work, with "cheap" mortgages, struggling to get buy as it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
esarmstrong Posted June 23, 2019 Share Posted June 23, 2019 3 hours ago, John1 said: Thought I read somewhere that it was coming with 4 complete engines. Could be wrong. Personally, as a cost reduction effort, I'd really prefer if WN were only to provide one full engine and offer others separately for those who just have to show each one exposed. Actually, since engines aren't "my thing", reduce costs even further by not including any engines and allow the individual modeler to purchase 1-4 Merlins separately, per their own whims. With regard to cost, per WN's website, they are trying to have the kit come in between $349 - $399. I'm confused by comments like yours about the mortgage needed to finance the kit. Maybe I'm an exception but I don't think $399 is a deal-breaker for an model like this (to me, the only real concern is the size of the damned thing). I see certain modelers bang out 4-5 (sometimes more) LSP kits a year, all of which probably cost ~ $100/ea (without including any aftermarket). And yet $399 for a kit that would probably keep a modeler (at one like me) busy for a year is somehow extreme? I just don't get comments like that. I understand that some folks on this site are on fixed budgets and this cost is beyond them but I'd be willing to bet that for the majority of the folks here, this cost isn't anything insurmountable. Not aimed at you specifically, just a general observation... Regarding the engines, I have just recently heard on youtube reviews (of the HK Lanc.) that the plan is to make one fully detailed engine and three "dummies" (whatever that might mean) for the other motors. Comparatively speaking, if the cost of this model is near or over $400.00, then I am not so sure about whether I would want it over a less expensive alternative that has all four engines with it. And then on top of that, you might be looking at the extra expense of buying the other three (3) engines to fill out the thing if complete engines are important to you. You say you are not an engine person, so this might not be a problem. It happens to be more important to me, personally, than it might be to others. Then there is the other thing I have heard on youtube reviews about the area behind the pilot and flight engineer being an empty husk. Again, this does not compare favorably with other options on the market presently. Many may not see this as a big deal because this area will be mostly obscured, unless it is creatively exposed in some way. On the positive side, what I have seen in pictures of the detail on the parts that can be seen is very impressive on the WNW kit. The turrets, engine, cockpit and engineers area and so forth are first rate in appearance. Regarding the price on the kit, the impression I am beginning to get is that the cost of creating the "oil can" appearance on this aircraft is accounting for a significant amount of its overall cost of production. Regarding the price, anything approaching or north of $300.00 is just "a bridge too far" for me. As they say, different strokes for different folks. I have purchased kits that had a retail price of more than $300.00, but I was able to get them for less than retail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan Posted June 23, 2019 Share Posted June 23, 2019 Fingers crossed the Lanc and the 0/400 could be at the Nationals, I’ll be picking up one of each. As far as cost, don’t really care. I don’t smoke or drink, golf, have a car restoration going on, have a boat, or any other vices or hobbies. Money well spent to me. Ryan The Dude, 19squadron, chrish and 3 others 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vince14 Posted June 23, 2019 Share Posted June 23, 2019 3 hours ago, DeanKB said: how many of us are that old enough, that far along in our careers, with family moved out (or no family to begin with) & mortgages paid off, to be able to afford it? I can. In fact, I can afford to get two of them if I wanted. Not sure what it proves. In any case, the Lanc will be a bargain compared to MFH's 1/12 scale car kits. Their Ferrari 250 TR sells for about £800 a pop. scvrobeson and Ryan 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vince14 Posted June 23, 2019 Share Posted June 23, 2019 3 hours ago, esarmstrong said: Then there is the other thing I have heard on youtube reviews about the area behind the pilot and flight engineer being an empty husk I'd take those comments with a pinch of salt. At this point in time no-one outside of WNW knows whether that area is going to be detailed or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LSP_K2 Posted June 23, 2019 Share Posted June 23, 2019 5 hours ago, DeanKB said: I'd take that bet. I suspect - with no evidence whatsoever - that the majority of LSP members would not spend $400 on a single model. For me, it all comes down to subject desirability. Whereas I'd seriously balk at $300 for most aircraft models, I'd drop the same amount in a New York minute for something I'm really passionate about (think Trumpeter 1:16 Jagdtiger), and I'm far from financially comfortable. Gazzas 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Finn Posted June 24, 2019 Share Posted June 24, 2019 I wonder when we'll see the bomb sprues, of course the loads varied, here is a mix of bombs and various size incendiaries in SBCs: https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/collections/document/7811 and this squadron, some went mining and others bombing: https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/collections/document/7140 also note the the stations where they were loaded on are listed plus type/number of Window and/or Nickels are listed in the above reports. Jari Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pup7309 Posted June 24, 2019 Share Posted June 24, 2019 (edited) At the end of the day price is relative. For me its expensive but if I was a Lanc fan, I'd be getting it. Will it's surface texture be the 'Dreadnought' that recessed panel lines was in the 90's? Interesting times. Edited June 24, 2019 by Pup7309 19squadron 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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