airscale Posted April 15, 2018 Author Share Posted April 15, 2018 evening folks ..by the way, today is a proud day - KLP Publishing published my book I clicked, I saw, I bought. Looking forward to reading it. Yey thanks Don, I really hope you enjoy it - I am very proud of it and what Kev has done - please let me know what you think? Well, it's only around 14 euro Juraj, so I reckon you don't need permission for that! Kev ...plus you feature in the Epilogue Juraj along with others who were around on 'that' day at the Nats, so what more reason do you need ... so.. we have a part... an actual, totally real, not made up on a computer, bit of this model... this is the target for today, the seat back - this picture is actually Lopes Hope's seat being painted so lets see what needs to be featured...there is a big pipe based 'U' frame giving it structure (the holes are at the back and not seen so we don't need to worry about them..), and to this is rivetted a pressing for the seat back.. ..there are also two slots with little pressing covers near the top of the back.. ..the front with some more details is not from my aircraft, but the details are the same... here the holes at the front can be seen to be bigger and that pressing itself actually wraps the 'U' frame right up to the edge and is fixed with the rivets taht can be seen. Also there are two slots with strengthening plate borders to capture too.. ..after scaling the drawings I have I noted a few differences between them and the seat in Lope's Hope, so I went with what I could see - first thing to do was to also scale and produce a drawing from that photo to use as a template to make a 'buck' onto which I will try and make the seat back pressing.. ..I got a bit of perspex as it is hard and takes shaping with a dremel well.. ..soon I had made the seat back in reverse, and had bent some rod to make the 'U'.. ..I drew the 'U' onto a bit of litho so I could anneal the edges that need to take the curves, but leave the seat back rigid so it doesn't deform or easily get dents & dinks in it.. ..then the sheet was taped to the buck and the edges worked into the curves - this is actually the third one I made and by then had learned it is easier to make the holes in the back of the seat while it is still a flat, stiff sheet so you might just be able to see them at the top of the pressing... ..then after marking out, I used my hold'n'fold to hold the part right where I needed to cut it and just ran a blade along it's length so I can bend, flex & snap away the waste easily and neatly without bending the curves just made.. ..the pressing was then taped to the 'U' frame and the edges centralised to the 'U'pipe all the way around by trimming with a sharp blade & then taking it off and finishing by filing & sanding... ..I also need to clean up everywhere as there is dust from dremelling out that perspex buck... ..once the seatback had been cut to shape it was taped down onto perspex to have a go at adding the rivets with a pin in a pin vise.. ..the strengthening plates / doublers that go around the slots in the side of the pressing were made by first cutting out the inside by scoring a rounded rectange using a template and then breaking away the inside... ..then they are trimmed & shaped & the seat back finished off.. ..and the finished (and very first!) part... ..and with some of the 'this is how I got here' parts - I never look at these as failures (though it can be frustrating sometimes), I always look at them as little lessons in themselves that teach me how to make the part properly... ..so that is it - we actually have a part - now there are only 12,324 to go... TTFN Peter GunnarO, Model_Monkey, NukerDan and 19 others 22 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kike_gt Posted April 15, 2018 Share Posted April 15, 2018 You make it look so easy! well maybe not that easy....but damn! I still can't figure out how you do all your stuff! you're on a league of your own! will keep following since I have not much to say other than wow everytime you update! Bravo! airscale 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gazzas Posted April 15, 2018 Share Posted April 15, 2018 Peter, What do you use to cut the aluminum? I can't imagine doing anything that nice with my left and right snips. Gaz airscale 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trak-Tor Posted April 15, 2018 Share Posted April 15, 2018 Well, it's only around 14 euro Juraj, so I reckon you don't need permission for that! Kev That's really no problem. The problem was I had no time for sitting in front of my comp yesterday. I had to tidy-up things around our flat first, then bring and assemble our new, kind of king-size, bed in our bedroom... Succesfully acomplished, so the book is on its way to my computer now. Peter, great progress on the seat. I've expected nothing less than that... What do you use to bend the rod so neatly? I had some problems to bend some tubes lately, but that's something different, of course. Keep it coming, please! Juraj LSP_Kevin and airscale 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KUROK Posted April 15, 2018 Share Posted April 15, 2018 This is a wonderful journey as was the Spitfire! Your work always makes me think of this fellow and his Ferrari: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SeUMDY01uUA airscale 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shawn M Posted April 16, 2018 Share Posted April 16, 2018 the master is back at it airscale 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TorbenD Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 Lovely Nuff said Torben airscale 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brahman104 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 Bravo Peter! The fans have been waiting patiently to see some more litho magic and you have not disappointed! The seat looks smashing already; can't wait to see the rest of it come to life Of course I have a question or two though...... On your doublers, how do you score and snap the inside lines without deforming the rest of the piece through the corner? Apologies for disfiguring your photo, but this is what I'm talking about.... Surely if you score and snap in one direction, it would deform across the other, or do you go very gently and then re-flatten the piece after? This is something I actively avoid and if there's a method to it I'd be very keen to hear! The other one is the little holes in the seat back. Clearly they aren't round, so how do you make them and keep them so clean? Do you start with a proper circle and then slowly expand? I'm massively impressed at how clean your perspex shaping is too. Is that all free-hand on the dremel? You put any of my milling work to shame! Always in awe Craig Jim Barry, daHeld, Starfighter and 2 others 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richdlc Posted April 18, 2018 Share Posted April 18, 2018 airscale, Harold, MikeMaben and 1 other 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolf Buddee Posted April 18, 2018 Share Posted April 18, 2018 You know Peter, if I don't comment too much in this thread, it's because someone else has already said it or I don't have anything intelligent to add but trust me I'm hangin' on your every word! Now excuse me while I go back to my plastic while you create magic in metal! Cheers, Wolf Shaka HI, airscale and daHeld 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dodgem37 Posted April 18, 2018 Share Posted April 18, 2018 Very nice. Sincerely, Mark airscale 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fightersweep Posted April 18, 2018 Share Posted April 18, 2018 Blimey! He's at it again! There's the rest of us playing with plastic, and Peter's doing ground up reproductions of the real thing. ....Now, where did I put my Starfix kit? airscale and daHeld 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeMaben Posted April 19, 2018 Share Posted April 19, 2018 airscale 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwana Posted April 19, 2018 Share Posted April 19, 2018 Holy. Crap. (slinks off into corner to cry) airscale 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
airscale Posted April 20, 2018 Author Share Posted April 20, 2018 evening ladies thanks for stopping by, things have been a bit crazy at work this week, but I did get a little done... but first some questions: Peter, What do you use to cut the aluminum? I can't imagine doing anything that nice with my left and right snips. Gaz Hi Gaz - I just score it once with a scalpel (I change the blades quite frequently) and then bend it backwards & forwards until it breaks cleanly. It needs very little persuasion once you get it moving ..this even works for curves, but if they are tight, or difficult then just scissors but with those you need tobe careful the 'active blade' is curling the metal you don't want, not the part... What do you use to bend the rod so neatly? I had some problems to bend some tubes lately, but that's something different, of course. Keep it coming, please! Juraj Hi Juraj - I just us a little brass clamp seen in some pics later, or pliers - I have both round nose and flats.. sometimes like in the case above it needs to be bent around something of the diameter of the inner radius of the corner you want. Tube is another matter - this will just kink, though there are tricks to get around it, the only way I have got to work in the diameters we work in is to fill the tube with wire at the bend point.. Of course I have a question or two though...... On your doublers, how do you score and snap the inside lines without deforming the rest of the piece through the corner? The other one is the little holes in the seat back. Clearly they aren't round, so how do you make them and keep them so clean? Do you start with a proper circle and then slowly expand? Craig Hi Craig - well the trick with those, and in fact both areas where holes are needed is to tape the template for the hole to the litho (if you don't have one, make one...) and then run round and round it with a sharp pin. This scores the metal quite deeply and you should keep going until you can see the outline of the scoring from underneath.. Then carefully use a blade to run along any straight areas and one or other side will start to give... once a side gives and becomes weak, I just hold the bit i want to break out and carefully wiggle the sheet around it - ultimately metal fatigue takes over and the part starts to break free. It can take time, so don't rush, and be gentle as as you say you can easily kink the corners or somewhere you don't want to bend.. ..if the hole you want is too small to hold between you fingers, I try and hold it in a hold'n'fold right along one of the scored edges, and then just push at it right at that edge with a tool and it too will soon start to break free so, onto the pilot's seat.. ..having made the back panel, the next part is the seat itself.. again this seems a bit of an enigma as some drawings and a lot of kits have a straight edge at the front - I have this pic which seems to marry with a few others that shows the front with a curved dip at the front, so I went with that.. ..to make what looks like a pressing I used the same process as for the seat back - a block of perspex acrylic shaped to form annealed metal over, so I started by marking out the outer dimensions and the inner point at which it curves inwards to form the 'bucket' ..then I used a cutting disc to work away the waste to get the main profile set out, including the dipped area at the front.. ..until this is further refined to get the ultimate profile I want... ..once I had the male form, I wanted to make the rod frame the pressing is fixed to so bent some brass rod until it was the same shape (which took a lot of fiddling...) and popped it in my clamp to solder where it joins - you can just see it in the clamp on the right.. ..once cleaned up, a final check that the buck and the frame fit together (allowing for the metal too..).. ..then a small square of litho is annealed an taped down - at this point just gentle pressure all the way round to sort of 'seat' it on the buck.. ..to get the proper form, I use a balsa block, and ultimately a tiny ball pein hammer to tap out any folds and combined with harder wood blocks start to force the softened metal to conform to the shape.. ..the final stage is to start taping it hard down around the edges and really making sure it is taking the form.. ..after removing the tape, I have the basic pressing - I should have been more careful as some perspex dust got under the tape and caused a few little divots.. ..I turned it over and used a sharpie to outline the shape of the frame onto the pressing and then cut it out by scoring the edges and scissors for the corners.... .. then it was CA'd into place, the edges rounded around the rod frame and cleaned up.. ..and when taped to the back it looks in proportion to the plan I have.. ..lots and lots of detail to add, but the basic shapes are there to start work on. I am hoping to find more reference for this kind of seat as inexplicably for one of the world's best known warbirds, I can find hardly anything that shows a seat like this one out of the airframe... TTFNPeter daveculp, MikeMaben, Trak-Tor and 18 others 21 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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