Tamiya F-15C Kicked Up A Notch- Dec 1/17: DONE!

[DonH]

You

Have

Got 

To

Be 

Kidding

Me

!

 

That is superb.

[Mr Matt Foley]

Great way to show most of the possibilities available in resin and plastic.  I appreciate the positive way you approached the subject as Mike, Bruce ( who mastered CE a decade ago), and myself all put a tremendous amount of time into the respective products.  The F-15 naked nozzles are tremendously detailed, and whether you use resin or plastic, there are serious compromises that have to be made if one does not want to use PE.   I for one am just glad that Eduard and Flightpath offer what they do so there is a mall metal option. 

 

Hereis the Hybrid PE method that Chuck is opting not to do.  Each Nozzle is 667 parts  and takes 50-55 hours to assemble.  close to 8 million!!!!!! LOL

 

Working on IAF 957 build at present and debating whether to not to use the Resin exhausts with TF's.  She has flown both ways and not sure which way to go.  The nozzles look so cool no matter which way you build them I hate to cover them up with tf's.  Here are some 90% pics of the new nozzles, still need to add the PE TF mounts.   Sorry the pics are not better, but the I phone only gets so close.

 

Great stuff , and thanks for all of the time you spend with these builds

 

Geez Gary....Amazing work as well. Post some photos of them with the TF on them.

[chuck540z3]

Very nice! Something on the stabilators - are you sure that they will stay perfectly straight to each other, and parallel according to the wings? Maybe a better idea is first to glue/adjust the wings and then the correct angle of the stabilators... That`s what i came across while doing mines - first the stabilators were added and they looked perfect. But after adding the wings - i had to re-adjust one of the stabilators slightly, which somehow went not exactly well, and so i ended up by gluing it permanently in the correct neutral pose. Of course, even a slightly bigger imperfection is not visible when the stabilators are moved at certain angle, but when are straight in neutral angle... 

 

And, very good looking nozzle flaps as well!

 

 

Hi Milan.  I'm not sure what you mean, because the stabilators are either flat horizontal or they're not- and the wings as well.  As mentioned earlier, according to references, the wings have a 1 degree anhedral (down) angle, so they should look as flat as the eye can detect.  That's why I use the drill bits for the stabilator pins.  They are perfectly straight, won't bend and I can drill a hole matching their diameter perfectly using another drill bit of the same size.  With round sprue, it's hard to find a piece that's perfectly round without a seam line and the exact size you want.

 

If you drill the hole in the stabilator completely centered, the drill pin has no choice but to be centered within the stabilator (and flat) as you push it inward towards the center where it is much thinner than the base.  The kit hole on the outside of the fuselage lines up very well with the hole on the inside, which is also dead flat, so it's really hard to screw up IF you make sure to widen the hole exactly in the center.  Now if all that doesn't make the stabilator flat, you could still widen the hole on the inside of the fuselage, glue the pin inside in the horizontal position, then just slip on the stabilator which can still rotate.

 

Cheers,

Chuck

[Joel_W]

What I appreciate about your builds Chuck is the wealth of information on techniques. I never thought to turn my pastels into a wash but you can bet I will now.

 

Tony,

   Just make sure that they're Acrylics 1st.

 

Joel

[Joel_W]

Chuck,

   I've used your pinning method several times in the past since I've seen it in one of your earlier builds. Rather then old useless drill bits, I have used brass and aluminum tubing, as well as straight pins from the sewing section of those big box discounters.

 

Joel

[F`s are my favs]

Here, for example, in this pic from wiki, in the front view pic...

 

 

the stabilators look in the perfect straight line to each other, but not perfectly parallel to the main wings, which is because of the negative dihedral. That`s what is the difficult thing to reproduce, according to me, because it might be easier to align the main wings first according to the fuselage, and then align the stabilators in the perfect neutral angle according to the main wings (to have the main wings as a referance point already).

 

While when the stabilators are in "motion", at a different angle - it`s good - it would be impossible to notice even the little imperfections in the straight alignment (of course, if there are any), cause visually, it`s normal that the stabilators may look unparalleled.

 

 

[F`s are my favs]

Hmm, i`m reading my comment again and it really is a little confusing... i mean, how you are sure in the correct alignment of the stabilators so they are in the perfect straight line to each other while in neutral pose? ))) By measuring the exact distance between the stabilators and the surface where you put the model? Or by testfitting the wings upon drilling the holes for the pins of the stabilators? Btw, i also used the vertical stabilizers for double-checking (90 degrees). Or some sort of alignment/paper template... ? It`s just interesting to me as i came across this same exercise a few days ago, and was much more trickier than i expected.

 

TU!

Edited March 7, 2017 by F`s are my favs

[chuck540z3]

One very difficult thing to see and measure is how horizontal the wings really are.  Since they are thick at the fuselage and thin at the tips, the top of the wing drops down, giving a dihedral look.  The front of the tips of the wings also curve down at the front, which makes them look like they are dropping even more.  However, if you draw a line from the bottom of the wing from the fuselage to the tip of the wing, in the middle of the wing, it is almost flat, or 1 degree according to F-15E references.

 

I also wouldn't trust a diagram from wiki, since many of those panel lines on the top are wrong already, so I don't trust the dihedral either.

 

Chuck

[Squizzy 78]

I'm a bit late commenting on your latest work Chuck, but better late than never. Simply amazing work, that is the best set of engine exhausts I've seen. I wouldn't be surprised if alclad wanted to use those images in their advertising!

[spyrosjzmichos]

Great tip Chuck! Thanks for sharing!

[Guest Peterpools]

Chuck My Man

Simply two superb updates and the work is meticulously done. Your exhaust have raised the bar to a level few will ever attempt to immolate and most likely none will ever achieve. I sit and start and the amazement hasn't sunken in.

As I ans others have said, the tutorials and explanations are worth twice the price of admission. So very much appreciated

Keep 'em coming

Peter

[Skyhawk174]

Yes sirree Chuck most exceptional work on those exhaust assemblies. They look HOT both to touch and in the photos. I think I can surely use your tips in 1/48 but since it is a smaller scale it might prove to be a touch difficult.

 

Very steady progress there to get to a final beautiful result.

[chuck540z3]

Mar 19/17

 

Thank you guys very much!  As always, I read and appreciate all feedback.  Now a small update which is not all that special, but in order to create a meaningful build log, I really should document each step properly- and I have 2 tips to demonstrate.

 

After much discussion above and all sorts of tweaks and dry fitting, I finally found out where about 80% of the problem is with the wing to fuselage fit with this kit:  It's the bottom fuselage lip!  In this pic I show where I sanded the bottom lip back about a millimeter front to back.

 

 

 

 

This bottom lip is holding the wing out too far at the bottom, so it creates a big gap at the top.  Once sanded, things snug up fairly tightly without any drama.  I will still need to add a bit of filler to the front of the wing, but almost none to the rest.  Remember, this is dry fit with no pressure to hold it together, so the gap is really less than it looks.

 

 

 

 

This small gap is a really good segue into my first modeling tip, which I'm sure others know about already, but I learned by accident a few years ago.  At the bottom of the wing is a really big gap between the 2 wing halves that should be filled.  Since this panel line actually exists, it should either be filled with CA glue and re-scribed, or easier yet if you have lots of time, just ooze in some Tamiya Extra Thin Cement (TETC) into the gap and watch it swell.

 

 

 

 

After 10-15 minutes, this is what it looks like.  The TETC has created a filler of its own, which is basically liquid sprue.

 

 

 

 

Jumping way forward after it has dried for a few days and re-scribed, the panel line is nice and thin as it should be- with no filler added.

 

 

 

 

Here's another trick that doesn't photograph very well at all, due to the lack of contrast on light colored plastic.  Here is the kit panel line as is, with no modification.  As on the rest of the fuselage, many of the panel lines are way too wide and not very sharp.  A close-up of the bottom wing

 

 

 

 

To thin the panel line, while making it more crisp, I re-scribe every single panel line on this model.  This accomplishes 2 things.  The panel line is straighter and more clean, but the scriber also pushes some of the plastic to the outside of the panel line, narrowing it slightly.

 

 

 

 

After, with a bit of black wash.  Nice and tight now.  Conclusion is, if you want to narrow a panel line, just re-scribe it!

 

 

 

 

Before I modified the wings, I checked out many pics of this area which are hard to come by in any great detail.  Jake's book has several pics, but they are from several feet away most of the time, so it is tough to determine which rivets should show and which ones should not at 1/32 scale.  One area that stuck out to me on the kit parts is the brace-like feature on both the flaps and aileron.  I don't see them on any of my pics of the real deal or in Jake's book, so I suspect they were an early feature that is now deleted?   If they really do exist, they should be almost invisible anyway, although checking other builds of this kit, every single one has kept them.  Sooo, I sanded them off anyway.....

 

 

 

Edited March 19, 2017 by chuck540z3

[chuck540z3]

Here is what I did to the wing to add detail, which has been highlighted with more black Tamiya panel line accent color.  In general, the rivet pattern of the kit parts was doubled, but in real life you could easily triple the rivets and not be wrong.  This looks like quite enough to my eye….

 

 

 

 

A few “walk-around†close-ups…..

 

 

 

 

 

 

I did not add as much detail to the bottom of the wings for 2 reasons.  Pics of the bottom of the real deal are almost impossible to find and, more importantly, you'll never see them later anyway!

 

 

 

 

I also drilled out the fuel dump spouts on the wing tips, since the kit parts are fairly blunt with no relief.

 

 

]

 

 

That's it for now boys.  I drive on with this build at my own pace and when I feel like it, unlike past builds where I felt obligated to post updates, rather than post them when I wanted to.  I find this process much more fun! 

 

 

Cheers,

Chuck

Edited March 19, 2017 by chuck540z3

[Skyhawk174]

Chuck I really appreciate you taking the time to post your progress on this build. I know many have said it but it sure is helpful and wonderfully illustrated. I almost regret I don't build in 1/32nd a lot especially something this big but modelling is modelling and I can appreciate great work when I see it.

 

I like you recent tip on filling the gap and I will try it on my next build. Sure do love that Tamiya cement.

 

Cheers

Chris