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brahman104

HK B-17...C!!!!!!!! 14/5 powering forward

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Thanks very much Kev, Jim, Peter and Zak. I'm humbled you guys have taken the time to follow along on the build! :)

 

This afternoon I got the seats in and had a crack at the control wheels, which, naturally aren't anything like the ones in the kit. (maybe next project should be OOB!)

 

I'm not entirely sure I've gone the right approach for these yet, but I'll post progress again soon, regardless of triumph or failure as this is a build log :)

 

Thinking ahead, I really want to get into the bomb bay. Kind of like the cockpit, I think I'm going to try and make it as a stand alone module that I can place in and out until I'm happy with it. I also want to go a little crazy and try to make the main parts out of brass, mainly because it looks cool. I'm going to have to go back and have another read of the way Peter made his outstanding cockpit parts using photo etch as that's the only way I can see of getting a lot of the fine work done.....

 

Thanks again

 

Craig :)

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Craig

 

Really nice job bringing the entire flight deck compartment to life, especially the lower section. Always like "models within models."

Your "guesstimate"of the rear seats is a combination of good logic and fantastic modeling on your part.

 

I've always wondered about the roof observation dome.

When it was off centered to the right on the B, I could see maybe the right seat cranking up into it, but what  about when it was moved centerline on the C/D? Step between the rear seats maybe? Any idea?

 

TKB

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Hi Terry,

 

Absolutely no idea about the whole standing in the dome bit, although I have been wondering that myself. I've not actually looked at how tall a person would be standing in between the two seats so I'm not sure if maybe there wouldn't be a need for an extra step. I've found nothing to mention one in anything I've read (I really wish the Air force museum in Dayton would hurry up and get moving on the swoose!) but I would make sense to have one and just because you can't see one in a photo doesn't mean it isn't there!

 

Thanks very much for looking in again and for the very timely discussion points you raise, keep them coming please!

 

Cheers,

 

Craig

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Craig,

 

I'm looking at a drawing (not actual blueprint) that appears pretty much scaled. Transposing the standing figure shown in the radioroom to the flightdeck, the top of the head is even with the roof line and not into the dome.

 

Have you glued the seats in position yet? To throw a fly in the ointment; the same drawing is showing the two rear seats slightly lower the the pilot/co-pilot seats, which don't make much sense, unless they are shown in the lowered position.

 

Like I said, this is off a general drawing, but it is a Boeing drawing.

 

Terry.

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Craig,

 

I'm looking at a drawing (not actual blueprint) that appears pretty much scaled. Transposing the standing figure shown in the radioroom to the flightdeck, the top of the head is even with the roof line and not into the dome.

 

Have you glued the seats in position yet? To throw a fly in the ointment; the same drawing is showing the two rear seats slightly lower the the pilot/co-pilot seats, which don't make much sense, unless they are shown in the lowered position.

 

Like I said, this is off a general drawing, but it is a Boeing drawing.

 

Terry.

 

Thanks Terry!

 

I have actually glued the seats in but I think I can live with that. However I do feel you are correct with your height estimations.....

 

What I did notice today when looking at it, was that from the bottom of the cockpit door to the bottom of the floor is roughly 10.5mm which in scale is quite a large drop, so it's entirely possible that there was kind of an "intermediate" step which would then double as a place to stand in the observation dome. Hopefully you can see what I mean below...

 

IMG_1391_zpsojddtac0.jpg

 

So this could be my "get out of jail free card." All I have to do is build a little raised platform between the two rear seats and all should return to being believable again.... Any thoughts on this? 

 

A little update now. I made the control yokes with a combination of heat formed styrene (in boiling water) and some heavy duty aluminium foil pressed down over a pattern. I then backfilled the shape with 5 minute epoxy and there you have it :)

 

IMG_1376_zpsozrxteuu.jpg

 

IMG_1377_zpsyfcjppex.jpg

 

IMG_1383_zpsahhko3gt.jpg

 

And a comparison to the kit one, which I believe the shape is correct for F models onwards, with the E retaining the old style from what I've seen...

 

IMG_1384_zpspbhrr8pk.jpg

 

And installed with the seatbelt painted.... starting to look like a cockpit now! :)

 

IMG_1388_zpsezgc988x.jpg

 

Next step is getting the underfloor area ready for paint as well as some lighting and details in the overhead panel. Stay tuned...

 

Craig

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Hello!

Long time "lurker", here and finally decided to get an account. I've been following this wonderful build from the start and am very impressed!

 

I compiled a bit of research on the early models for a 48 scale -B project that has now been placed indefinitely on hold, and some cad stuff. I think I can help with the observation dome step question.

 

Here is a scan from the B-17C manual that identifies an "observation step" on the rear bulkhead:

 

Screenshot_2015-09-29-07-04-30.png

 

And here is a clearer technical photo showing that's more of a little ladder than a box as one would have expected.

 

Screenshot_2015-09-29-07-12-45.png

 

On the topic of seat supports, here's a shot of the Swoose I found off Google image search a few years back that shows the rear support. Although the padding is faded, the metal components show the original bronze green to good effect:

 

01-09-09077.jpg

 

I've got some other references if interested... I haven't confirmed it for the -c yet, but the -b had a folding map table on the back of the copilot seat. There's also a very unique panel that sits on top of the instrument panel for all versions up to -d that had Id lights and warning indicators in it. Hope this helps!

Look forward to seeing more!

Best,

Trystan

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Thanks Kev and Loic!

 

Trystan, welcome indeed and thanks very much for chipping in with some very useful info! Thanks heaps for the photos too.... I haven't seen those before, but it appears my assumptions were correct... good to know. I do see that that C photo shows back armour... oh well can't win them all I suppose and it may have not always been a standard fit depending on the time period.

 

Between yourself and Terry, I have pretty much everything I need covered. Thanks again!

 

I'm glad you're enjoying the build mate, feel free to comment or query at any point :)

 

Cheers,

 

Craig

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Thanks for the welcome!

 

Regarding the armor, the second photo is also confirmed to be a -c, and it doesn't have the seat armor. Most photos I've seen of the c/d lack the armor, actually, so you're still spot on. I suspect the T/o photos are of fully kitted out aircraft showing "what's possible", but not always found in production.

 

I can send the -c manual scan in pdf if interested... Pretty sure I found it on another forum awhile back.

 

It has some useful system diagrams, a few photos, but more useful, a full description of the auxiliary equipment and locations.

 

Cheers,

 

Trystan

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Craig,

 

I have absolutely no idea how I missed this build, but I have spent the last 90 minutes reading every single post and comment here.

this is absolutely astounding work in every way, and has seriously gotten my 'juices' flowing.

I love the look of the early model B-17, and you're nailing it, sir!

I have a project or two germinating in the back of my mind that I want to attempt one of these years, especially a certain twin engine Curtiss transport, and I've come to the realization that the only way I'm ever going to get there is to do it myself.

 

Your quick mastering, or at least understanding, the basics of CAD is amazing. I've done a bit of reading on the subject, and I'm almost of the opinion that it's beyond me.

you're ability to see these shapes in space looks like it's saved you countless months of the old fashioned way of drawing, cutting, gluing, planking, shaping, sanding, tossing it out, and redoing it until it's close.

The attention to the smallest detail you have been showing here is just amazing to me. Being able to jump from the basic forming of a fuselage shape to micro detailing a throttle pedestal is mind blowing.

 

Keep up the awesomeness, and I'll keep drooling and dreaming...

 

Ernie

 

Hi Ernie,

 

Thank you! I'm really glad you stumbled upon the build and it's providing you with some enjoyment.

 

I wouldn't say CAD is beyond anyone's skills really, I looked at the incredible work Peter was able to achieve in a very short space of time and just figured you've got to start somewhere right? His work is much, much more advanced than mine but I picked up enough of the basics to make me dangerous without too much trouble.

 

I agree wholeheartedly that this new technology has the definite potential for anyone to make into reality those long dreamt about projects and I certainly can't see a C-46 being any more challenging than what I've done here. I think like anything, trying to get the best references you can to go off is the hardest part, but at the end of the day if you as the modeller are happy with it then that's all that matters!

 

It has, as you said, certainly saved me a TON of work in vac forming and prototyping and the very best parts are that if it's symmetrical, you only have to draw it once, once you've drawn it you can set up the printer and go to bed (so it's modelling without the time investment!) and if you stuff up a part just print a new one!

 

One of my long term dreams is a large scale CH-21. Yet another advantage for me personally, given that I'm away for work a lot, is that I can still continue to design and effectively build while I'm away, so that when I do get home, it's straight into the physical modelling we all love so much :) I think that project will be one I'll look at during my next big stint away from home.

 

Thanks again Ernie and I hope you continue to follow along on the journey.

 

Cheers,

 

Craig

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Trystan,

Welcome.

First time I have ever seen any rear facing photo of a early B-17 cockpit. Thank you!

Goes to show you; there's always someone, somewhere with the answers --- with documentation!

Observation dome step/platform mystert solved.

 

Craig,

If you didn't post WIP photos of the control yoke, I'd swear you found an aftermarket cast resin part!

That is some really remarkable work on such a small part. You certainly know how to "think out of the box".

If the praises given you so far on this build embarrass you in any way, you'd beter just get use to it! Hopefully the recognition you're receiving will keep your build juices flowing.

 

Terry

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