GuildAero Posted April 22, 2013 Author Share Posted April 22, 2013 Thanks for your post, Milan. I take your point, of course. It's just the assumption that we're out to cause damage or lead the public astray that annoys me. And at Old Warden, the fee they want for having a guide with us who is, after all a volunteer. Why does he cost, when he doesn't cost the museum anything? Maybe if the old Health and Safety tosh wasn't trotted out every time like a mantra, I wouldn't get so annoyed. A simple precis of your post would be much better. Anyway, permission granted today by e-mail and I hope we will be allowed to do what we need, although he did make it clear we would NOT have access to the cockpit for some reason, which suggests there will not, after all, be a guide. Just as well I have a lot of nice cutaways and line drawings of the innards of a Gnat cockpit already. I'll no doubt have more to report when I get back from Newark. Cheers, Martin geedubelyer 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phartycr0c Posted April 23, 2013 Share Posted April 23, 2013 (edited) Martin, just a thought, how about contacting the Museum at Cosford, They have two Gnats, a T1 and F1 and there are no entrance charges. Bearing in mind that during the model shows etc, stalls are placed right underneath the aircraft wings and noses, im sure they would accommodate a few pre arranged measurements being taken. Now if you wanted to measure the Lightning hanging from the ceiling of the cold war hangar, now that would be a different matter. I know it would be a jaunt for you from East Anglia but believe me its well worth a day out. Edited April 23, 2013 by Phartycr0c Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GuildAero Posted April 23, 2013 Author Share Posted April 23, 2013 Thanks for the info, but it would be too much of a jaunt, I'm afraid. There wouldn't be time to get there, measure and get back. When I lived afloat I wasn't that far from there, but was a few years ago now. These days, fuel costs have to be taken into account, alas. Oterwise I'd love to go and have a browse around. I've now got permission to measure the Gnat at Newark, so we're sorted out for now and I can possibly go and measure the Chipmunk tomorrow afternoon at Felthorpe. Cheers, Martin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fred Jack Posted April 24, 2013 Share Posted April 24, 2013 You young guys are so spoiled. Back in the day, there was no Internet. All models only approximated scale. If you wanted to research a German plane, the reference books were written in German, Japanese planes in Japanese. The USA and the Allies couldn't get Russian or Chinese references. All reference books were in a library and could not be checked out. To get to the library we had to walk 10 miles uphill both ways barefoot in the snow with 80 mph winds in a full blizzard with freezing rain at 40 degrees below zero because it was too cold to hitch the horses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LSP_Kevin Posted April 24, 2013 Share Posted April 24, 2013 You young guys are so spoiled. Back in the day, there was no Internet. All models only approximated scale. If you wanted to research a German plane, the reference books were written in German, Japanese planes in Japanese. The USA and the Allies couldn't get Russian or Chinese references. All reference books were in a library and could not be checked out. To get to the library we had to walk 10 miles uphill both ways barefoot in the snow with 80 mph winds in a full blizzard with freezing rain at 40 degrees below zero because it was too cold to hitch the horses. You're not related to Stephen at all are you Fred? Kev Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fred Jack Posted April 25, 2013 Share Posted April 25, 2013 I'm not related to Stephan, but I did send a friend request, but now that it has been mentioned and I am a Chippewa Indian, maybe I could pull out my Bowie and offer to make him my blood brother. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fred Jack Posted April 25, 2013 Share Posted April 25, 2013 One thing that a lot of people aren't aware of is that repeated camera flashes damage fabric. If you go to the Smithsonian Air And Space Museum or The Wright Paterson Museum, fabric covered aircraft are in dimly lit displays. Many metal aircraft before the 50s had fabric control surfaces at least. Hmm, maybe I am related to Steffen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fred Jack Posted April 25, 2013 Share Posted April 25, 2013 I remember, when I was a teen, we could walk anywhere at any airport and walk around any airplane we found interesting. We just have to be careful while crossing runways. The most fun was running behind either a Connie, Super Connie, or a Strato Liner as they taxied to the runway. When they reached the runway we would brace ourselves as they powered up their 4 engines for takeoff and we would see who could remain standing the longest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fred Jack Posted April 25, 2013 Share Posted April 25, 2013 I remember some kids tying a long rope to their wagons and loop the rope around the landing gear legs and hold onto the end. As the plane gain speed, they would let go of the rope, which would slide off the leg. Only once the rope got caught, and the kid had to bail. We don't know how long the wagon stayed with the plane. Maybe it even ended up a twisted pile of metal or pieces when the plane, a DC-6 landed. The kid got pretty bruised up so no one did that again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edgar Brooks Posted April 25, 2013 Share Posted April 25, 2013 (edited) One thing that a lot of people aren't aware of is that repeated camera flashes damage fabric.Sorry, but I've heard that one trotted out, before,and it's utter nonsense. The average flash duration is 1/1000th of a second, so you would need 1,000 flashes (on exactly the same point) to equal 1 second of "extra" daylight. Properly-constructed and painted fabric surfaces have an undercoat of silver, below the surface paints, specifically to reflect heat and light back. Service life of fabric was 5 years, during the war; taking 12 hours of daylight per day, you will need 7,884,000,000 flashes to equal that amount of daylight. Edited April 25, 2013 by Edgar Brooks Fred Jack 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Artful69 Posted April 25, 2013 Share Posted April 25, 2013 ... Years ago, I measured Jaguar's XJ13 and had to have somebody standing shotgun over me, but she was rather tasty and we flirted the whole time ... Martin Dear lord ... where do I sign up for your job!!!!! ... oh the things you must endure for the love of modeling ... Seriously though, it is always a pain when you have some twit looking over your shoulder watching everything you do ... especially when they ask a ton of questions unceasingly while you try do your work ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GuildAero Posted April 25, 2013 Author Share Posted April 25, 2013 Exactly! Although I had a wonderful time at the old Flying Club yesterday, I am finding essential bits unmeasured, precisely because the others were chatting to me out of not watchfulness, but simple friendly interest! Plus someone was jacking an Auster with a scissor jack on a paint tin. As I saw that start to crease, I had to lose track of the wing tip I was measuring and warn him! Ergo, no wing tip measurements, I discover. Of course, going back again won't exactly be a wrench! No tasty young ladies at Felthorpe yesterday, only ever older farts like me! But Summer's coming...sometime. I struggle on with my calling Martin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GuildAero Posted May 2, 2013 Author Share Posted May 2, 2013 Well, today, I was at Old Warden with my colleague. After a nice cup of tea outside in the sunshine, we were greeted by our guide outside who had been primed we were going and he, Colin, showed us through the entire museum to the last hangar, where we were let in to inspect, photograph and measure the Dragon Rapide to our heart's content. Colin helped with holding the tape and the squares, chatted in a friendly, helpful way and left us at the door when we had done, about 4 hours later. A wonderful day, topped off with a pint of Cornish ale in Ramsey. Tomorrow we do it all over again at Newark for the Folland Gnat! Cheers, Martin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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