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Derek B

F-4B Conversion - Your thoughts and ideas (again) please?

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Hello All,

 

Once more, I would be interested in your views about a 1/32 F-4B conversion set in the same way as that for the F-4G conversion (and for similar reasons).

 

Which kits would form the best base model for converting to an F-4B?

 

What would you like to see in the set?

 

Other than the airframe conversion requirements, are there any additional items specific to f-4Bs that you would like to see in the set?

 

Markings?

 

Cockpit upgrades (retro-grades?)

 

Anything else?

 

I see the F-4B in a similar vein to the F-4G - enough work to make the set 'very busy', but still a lot less and quicker to make than the F-4K/M conversion. Again, your views and thoughts would be most welcomed.

 

Many thanks

 

Derek

Edited by Derek B

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The best start point for a F-4b conversion is the Tamiya C/D. I have the old CAM stuff and was lucky enough to "pick" my sets, so they are not warped nor pinholed. The biggest issue with that set....The set does not flatten out the bottom of the wings. The work around is to fill and sand flat. Not impossible but it is still a pain in the &%&*^^. No one does a proper B cockpit. The J pit is drastically different. The pit has held me off form the conversion.

 

The C/E stuff is very nice better in detail, cleaner cast, more complete, but still no proper B pit.

 

 

Rob

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The best start point for a F-4b conversion is the Tamiya C/D. I have the old CAM stuff and was lucky enough to "pick" my sets, so they are not warped nor pinholed. The biggest issue with that set....The set does not flatten out the bottom of the wings. The work around is to fill and sand flat. Not impossible but it is still a pain in the &%&*^^. No one does a proper B cockpit. The J pit is drastically different. The pit has held me off form the conversion.

 

The C/E stuff is very nice better in detail, cleaner cast, more complete, but still no proper B pit.

 

 

Rob

 

Great Rob - this is exactly the type of feedback I need! Looks like I need some cockpit photographs and instrument panel layouts then for the F-4B? As far as the flat wing issue is concerned, I am certain that I can produce a resin modification part that will do the job more than adequately ;) .

 

Cheers

 

Derek

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I agree with Rob, the C/D would form the best basis for a -B. And while at it, would it be possible to fix the aft,lower fuselage to accomodate correct diameter burner cans? Wasn't aware of the wing problem, but then again, I haven't yet built any of Tamiya's Phantoms.

 

Stein

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I have some shots of the board and a 1/48 scale pit I found online. Shoot me a note with your email and I will send them.

 

Hi Rob. E-mail sent (apparently, you are not receiving PMs?).

 

Thanks

 

Derek

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I agree with Rob, the C/D would form the best basis for a -B. And while at it, would it be possible to fix the aft,lower fuselage to accomodate correct diameter burner cans? Wasn't aware of the wing problem, but then again, I haven't yet built any of Tamiya's Phantoms.

 

Stein

 

Hi Stein,

 

Sounds like the Tamiya 1/32 F-4C/D is the way to go then :speak_cool:

 

You'll just have to remind/enlighten me as to the burner can diameter issue here please, then maybe I can figure a way out to correct it?

 

Cheers

 

Derek

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My inbox was full, lol sorry about that. I replied and attached the images. I will look around to see if I have any personal shots at home!

 

Rob

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Sorry guys but I FULLY disagree!

 

The J has all the NAVY parts you need. It make no sense to re-create in resin all the parts to add them to the C/D considering the price difference between both kits. The cost would be higher!

 

From a business standpoint, the J is the logical approach. Otherwise, you'll have to add at least:

 

- cockpit parts

- take-off hooks inserts

- IFR probe

- slatted stabs

- wheel rims & doors

- pylons

- antenna

 

This means at the very least 40£ of resin parts to change the C/D into a J!

 

Look here:

 

http://www.cybermodeler.com/hobby/details/ce/images/cec32185_parts.jpg

 

When CE did different B sets for the C/D & J, they used the modular approach I mentioned some days ago as they considered that a noticeable part of the already sold C/D could be converted into a B.

 

A good overview: http://www.hyperscale.com/2007/reviews/accessories/cec32180reviewbg.htm

 

However, if you start from the J, here's what you need besides the major airframe parts if you want to make a very early B:

 

http://www.cybermodeler.com/hobby/details/ce/images/cec32187_parts.jpg

 

You see the difference? Moreover, most modellers will prefer a Vietnam era one!

 

Situation is different now as the Cutting Edge set has ALREADY been released. This means that people having a C/D, no CE set but still willing to build a B will probably be quite lower, don't you think so?

 

So, if you want a Vietnam war B, you'll have to focus on this:

 

http://www.cybermodeler.com/hobby/details/ce/images/cec32180_parts.jpg

 

Note they never released the correct cockpit parts! Main difference with the J are the RIO IP and port instrument consoles.

 

Thierry

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One thing to mention is that CE left the proper short exhausts out of their J to B conversion. They sold those separately, so although it looks like there are a lot fewer parts in the J conversion, it's because they left out a major part. Essentially, their common B conversion was the heart of the conversion. The C/D and J sets simply supplied resin copies of the needed parts from the other kit. Neither set had proper parts for the B rear cockpit (that was another planned set, although it was never released). The Tamiya J kit has a more proper rear Navy-style cockpit, although the only difference from the AF cockpit IIRC was the right side console part either being a circuit breaker panel for the C/D or a quilted sidewall for the -J; not a major parts difference. I have both the CE conversions, and I'm not sure which is really the better way to go. It's six of one or half-dozen of the other.

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Yikes.............my head is swimming with Phantom versions...........Bs.............Cs..............Ds..................Fs...............Gs male20-male-cross-eye-dizzy-smiley-emoticon-000062-large.gif

 

 

Ive got the J at home but honestly the only version of the phantom Im interested in atm (and I know im WAY in the minor here) is the S!

 

Already have all necessary pieces parts for it at home, but took some doing from multiple AM sources. I know it would not ever be feasible or worthwhile from a business standpoint to make a complete S model conversion, but it sure would have been nice......

 

Brian

Edited by Out2gtcha

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Correct Dave!

 

I'd have mentioned this point. However, the C/D kit exhausts are far from terrific in comparison with already available resin options. So, in my eyes, this does not really change the equation but I agree this may be different for other modellers.

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Yikes.............my head is swimming with Phantom versions...........Bs.............Cs..............Ds..................Fs...............Gs male20-male-cross-eye-dizzy-smiley-emoticon-000062-large.gif

 

 

Ive got the J at home but honestly the only version of the phantom Im interested in atm (and I know im WAY in the minor here) is the S!

 

Already have all necessary pieces parts for it at home, but took some doing from multiple AM sources. I know it would not ever be feasible or worthwhile from a business standpoint to make a complete S model conversion, but it sure would have been nice......

 

Brian

 

Yeah, I know what you mean Brian :wacko:

 

I think that what I need right now is a definitive list of what is really needed for Phantoms of all marks by modellers in order of priority and at the same time, will not step on other manufacturer's toes!

 

I am personally happy to look at all Phantom variants in terms of upgrades and needs (yes, including the F-4S), but I need to understand exactly what is required for them, and that is why I am relying heavily at the moment upon the the expertise and advice of those members of LSP who really know the aircraft well (for which I am continually grateful - I do like - and try - to get things as correct as possible if I can).

 

Cheers

 

Derek

Edited by Derek B

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Yes, there are nice resin burners out there for the C/D, however, they all just replace the kit burners. That means they still have the wrong diameters. Correct diameter cans means a large re-work of the surrounding airframe. BTW, did the -B have the bulged wing roots of later variants?

 

Stein

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