big matt Posted December 21, 2008 Share Posted December 21, 2008 Hi Bob, The parts not orange/yellow were painted in a silver/aluminum color, maybe FS17178. The wings were orange /yellow, just not sure of the FS#. Matt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaeone57 Posted December 22, 2008 Share Posted December 22, 2008 Bob, Brandon Wood, The interiors for SBD-1 and -2's were in fact Aluminum pigmented Silver Dope Laquer, as well as the Exterior color on these Pre-War aircraft, with the exception in the interiors of being over sprayed with a Flat Clear Anti-Corrosive overcoat. The Yellow-Orange is the same FS# as the Prop tip Yellow-Orange used in between the Insignia Red, and Insignia Blue striped tips or the solid Orange-Yellow tips used after the tri-color tips were changed. I shall unpack the box that contains all the data concerning the SBD-1, and -2 in Yellow Wings livery to share this info with you. If you don't mind I will post it on this thread. Please, let me know otherwise. Peace, Alfonso Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brandon Wood Posted December 23, 2008 Share Posted December 23, 2008 Alfonso I operated under the assumption that the SBD-1s delivered to VMB-1 and -2 had the aluminium tinted laquer, but there are several photos, in color, taken at the time of airframe delivery that demonstrates that they were actually delivered with Interior Green. The first I was made aware of this was the October 2001 issue of "Wings" and other photos surfaced later. I will try and find digital versions of the pics and post. Further reinforcing the issue is the fact that the last batch of TBD-1s, also a Douglas product, rolled off the production line in the Yellow Wing scheme, with Interior Green pits, as shown here http://images.google.com/hosted/life/f?q=T...77db3997db2c41f These aircraft came off the line right before the SBD-1s, so if Douglas was already applying the Interior Green to USN aircraft, I find it hard to believe they would revert back to the aluminium. BW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LDSmodeller Posted December 23, 2008 Share Posted December 23, 2008 Hi all Looking at the photo of the TBD-1 I would wager that the cockpit is actually more Bronze Green than Chromate Green (typical USN Cockpit colors for the time) Interestingly enough, a commmon misconception is that the whole Cockpit was always aluminum laquer color up until the change to painted cockpits (Bronze Green/Dk Green). Later on (not sure on actual date of that, possibly 1939-40)USN reg's called for the upper half of the cockpit painted black to cut down on glare . (I know for certain the Brewster F2A-2 did) Regards Alan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brandon Wood Posted December 25, 2008 Share Posted December 25, 2008 Alan, great photos of the F2A pit. They also illustrate the point that cockpit painting was evolving and changing all the time. If I am not mistaken, the first Vought F4U-1s also had black upper panels in an effort to cut down on glare, even though most people operate under the premise that they were Interior Green through and through. As for the pic of the TBD-1 with the green pit, that is def more Interior Green than Bronze Green. Grumman was the primary user of the Bronze Green, while Brewster used a Dull Dark Green that is close. The Bronze green that Grumman used was very dark, almost black, with a bluish hint to it. I believe that Curtiss also used a Bronze Green for a while, but I am not sure how it compares to the Grumman product. Cockpit interiors have been through a sort of evolution since I started modeling 20 years ago. Back then, it seemed as though Zince Chromate was the color all aircraft used, then it was thought that any US aircraft manufactured before 1941 or so had an aluminium tinted laquer coat, and now it is known that certain aircraft delivered during the transistition may have had yellow wings and green interiors. For me, the research goes hand in hand with the actual model building, with equal enjoyment. One of my future projects is to build an early F4U-1 with the black and green pit with SALMON PINK wheel wells since it is known Vought used a red tint in their primer! BW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LDSmodeller Posted December 26, 2008 Share Posted December 26, 2008 Hi Brandon Thanks for the comments, especically re the Dk Green used by Brewster (on this I would be very interested if you had any pictures/written commentary on this that you might be willing to share) I am close to(trying to) finishing off a Brewster 339E Buffalo in RAF colors and would really be interested in what Brewster did use, a common misconception is that RAF 339E Buffalos had RAF type interior paint for the cockpit As far as the TBD-1 I would just like to clarify that I was just referring to the actual cockpit area where the pilot was sitting, the rear crew area is most definately Chromate green. The reason I stated Bronze Green for the cockpit is because it had the appearance of Bronze Green appearing more like the darker oily appreance and (well to my eye anyway) similar to the Bronze Green used on this TBF-1c under restoration (at MOTAT) in the bomb bay and yes it is WWII original paint direct from Grumman (Note the Bronze Green only!) Having said all that, I am very much aware that WWII color photos can at times trip you up in areas like contrast, Sun strike etc, so what may appear perhaps to be Bronze Green, is in fact Chromate green due to a number of factors. Regards Alan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
49bull Posted December 26, 2008 Author Share Posted December 26, 2008 As it seems the interior color of the aircraft were changing during the time the yellow wing SBD-1's were being produced, which probably means as has been stated that some had the interior painted zinc chromate, I am going to poceed with a yellow wings SBD-1 with the green interior. If nothing else I am taking artistic license based on several relaibale sources supporting both aluminum and green interiors. The only other information that I could use is the FS number of the wing color as it was not yellow but more a yellow orange or I have seen chromate yellow noted as the color in some cases. Then I will order the needed decals and stencils and finish this baby. Thanks for all the information! Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brandon Wood Posted December 29, 2008 Share Posted December 29, 2008 It took me a while, but here are the pics of the SBD-1s with what appears to be Interior Green pits. These pics are on Lynn Ritger's website, which is currently being rebuilt, and were provided to him by Pete Chalmers. These two pics pretty much convinced me that the pits were NOT aluminium lacquer and with the TBD-1 pic showing that Douglas had already started using Interior Green, I am sold. I know that specs, manuals, and orders often give us a starting point, but photographic proof is always best. BW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
49bull Posted January 4, 2009 Author Share Posted January 4, 2009 I am busy building up the Eduard flaps for this baby and that is like building a minor kit in and of itself! I should have some photos of these shortly (this week) at least the individual flaps. Then its adding the accuator pieces which are individual PE parts to which plastic rod is attached to position the flaps in the open position. I will probably just have the lower flaps open as my understanding is that the upper flaps were closed except during a bombing run. According to sources, the interior of the flaps is the same as the exterior for the SBD-1's when looking at a yellow wings version. Therefore, the lower flaps will be aluminum interior with the uppers a yellow orange or chromate yellow interior/exterior. I am not sure about the -2's in the blue/gray scheme but it is suggested that they early on had the same type of paint scheme for the interior of the flaps (uppers blue/lowers gray) which was eventually changed to the red that is the most comon color for the flap interiors. Any information relating to the flap configuration is greatly appreciated and if anyone knows the yellow tone used (yellow/orange, chromate yellow) that would help as well. Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
49bull Posted February 17, 2009 Author Share Posted February 17, 2009 It took some time but I finally have more pictures to post and give you an update on the progress of my build. After conversing with Wayne tevlin at Yellow Wings, it is possible that yellow wing SBD-2's had green interiors and the interior of the flaps was aluminum. From that, I decided to proceed with my project as a yellow wing SBD-2 and model the #2106 SBD-2 in its yellow wing configuration. Wayne gave me the paint colors he uses for these aircraft which are Tamiya enamels in spray cans: Camel Yellow for the upper wing surface and gloss aluminum for the rest of the aircraft. Thus far the fuselage except for the engine cowling has been painted in the aluminum and I also painted the tail and horizontal stabilizers lemon yellow using Tamiya acrylic paint applied with an Aztec airbrush. The Eduard flaps have been built up and painted appropriately so that I am now in the final stages of completing this kit. The next steps will be attaching the engine compartment and wing assembly to the fuselage followed by the engine cowling. To display the engine, I have decided to paint just one half of the clear cowling for this purpose. I will then add the flaps and the flap mechanisms which open and close the flaps. As this is being done, I will mask and paint the canopy and get the rest of the attachments ready (bombs, tail hook, prop, etc.) and apply the decals. I think I may finish by month's end though it will be close. If not, there will just be very minor things left to do. On to some pictures which will take several postings due to the 100kb limit. To start here are the flaps showing outer and inner sides to see the color and detail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
49bull Posted February 17, 2009 Author Share Posted February 17, 2009 Next up a shot of the fuselage without the engine compartment but painted in the proper colors: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
49bull Posted February 17, 2009 Author Share Posted February 17, 2009 Here is a shot of the upper wing surface painted in camel yellow. Next will be the underside of the wing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
49bull Posted February 17, 2009 Author Share Posted February 17, 2009 As promised here is the underside of the wing painted gloss aluminum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
49bull Posted February 17, 2009 Author Share Posted February 17, 2009 Finally, I set the fuselage into the wing just to test fit it and decided to take a photo of it to get an idea of how it will look. Hard to distinguish the different yellow colors in this photo but the lemon yellow is definitely more yellow. Now let me get the engine compartment in place and glue the wings to the fuselage! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DougN Posted February 18, 2009 Share Posted February 18, 2009 Looking good, glad to see more progress on the kit! I plan to do mine as a USMC bird when I get around to pulling it out of the stash - impressive work! Cheers, Doug Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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