Valkyrie Designs - Lockheed Electra Junior

[RCPlym]

3 hours ago, Hubert Boillot said:

My one-pound Potez 25

 

Is it 1/32? Solid print?

[Jim Barry]

Ok, just checking on the rivet pattern the wings here now. 

 

 

My first impression was from this picture and I thought I was free and clear since it all looked so smooth. 

 

 

 

 

 

But I was wrong.....They certainly do show in different light and are likely very flush, but they are there! Thousands of 'em! There's also a bit of something like "raised panel line" where they butt up. That's not that hard. (pipe is a great way to add features like that). I think it's really going to help the model pop, all of this. The 30's art deco comes through since it has a bit of steam punk to it, you know? 

 

 

Edited August 18 by Jim Barry

[Jim Barry]

This is what they mean when they say "In the thick of it"

 

(Blue is sketches. Purple is sketch lines projected onto surfaces (and then have rivets patterned on these paths, oddly called curves when in the dialogue box) 

 

 

 

 

 

[Hubert Boillot]

8 hours ago, RCPlym said:

 

Is it 1/32? Solid print?

Lukgraph kit, converted to a Potez 25 TOE with own-designed 3D-printed parts. 
 

The base Lukgraph kit is already heavy, with, for instance, a solid wing, that, alone weighs 186 grams …

 

Hubert

 

[Hubert Boillot]

The « good » news is that the wing rivets are flush, Jim … so just recessed circles rather than dimples …

 

Hubert

[Cicchino]

9 hours ago, Jim Barry said:

There's also a bit of something like "raised panel line" where they butt up. That's not that hard. (pipe is a great way to add features like that)

 

6 hours ago, Jim Barry said:

(Blue is sketches. Purple is sketch lines projected onto surfaces (and then have rivets patterned on these paths,

 

Jim, 

 

I landed on the same workflows - time consuming and tedious is an understatement. Riveting being far and away the least enjoyable part of the 3D design for me - given all the angles and curves involved, just establishing viable planes that even allow successful projections just adds to the annoyance factor. I've found I've moved adding surface details to the very end of the design process - making sure all the shapes and fits are correct before starting to add surface details, otherwise the PC repeatedly crunching and recrunching the data just slows the process to a crawl. The downside being that elephant in the room is always looming in front of the finish line. Interestingly, Kotare takes a very similar approach with their test shots on injection molded kits. . 

 

Keep it up, you're doing incredible work!

 

Regards

 

John

[Jim Barry]

Thanks John. I might make a video here to show technique because I really don’t struggle with planes much at all. The tedious part is setting the rivet into the surface of the aircraft. Yes, get most work done first! Big to small just like the kits. 
 

Question about performance because other than saving and loading big projects, my 4 yr old PC does really well. The key is a dedicated graphics chip like an nvidia GeForce. Do you have that? 

[Jim Barry]

Rivet Demo

 

 

Edited August 18 by Jim Barry

[Hubert Boillot]

I’m a Mac man, but bought a gamer’s PC, with a big graphic card, to just run the 3D model long software (Alibre).

 

I went back to the R-985 design regarding the oil sump. Views from perspective, front and side.

1) the core engine block and the oil sump in its correct relative position

 

 

 

 

2) the oil sump front attachment point on the réduction great crankcase

 

 

 

3) the rear attachment point is on the intake manifold crankcase

 

the right side of the intake manifold crankcase is towards the front of the engine in the below pic.

 

HTH

 

Hubert

 

Edited August 18 by Hubert Boillot

[Jim Barry]

Top notch Hubert. I'm missing the sump in my engine. I will add it! 

Edited August 18 by Jim Barry

[Jim Barry]

Not as detailed as yours, but it's the same shape front view.   I used your image  as a canvas to make mine. Thx

 

 

[Jim Barry]

OK on to testing these rivets which perhaps should have happened earlier but these smaller (possibly flush) rivets on the wing has me worried. So, Hubert suggested I model these as holes and I totally agree with that look, but it's a pain because holes are not bodies and do not "pattern" well. The work around seems to be a pain. With thousands of things I can't just create a bunch of columns, sink them and then cut the body they intersect. I did that with a few rivets on the cowl, but it's just not for mass production. Anyway, I decided to stay with the pop rivets and see what they really look like to the eye by printing them in 1/32. So this is under extreme magnification (primered with tamiya extra fine) and lots of sunlight and it's fine and the size seems very realistic, but in anything but perfect bright light, you can't see 'em! Which is interesting because that's why it seems there are no rivets in many pictures of the real thing. So..I don't know the exact value of this realistic portrayal when it all gets lost to normal human version in a room. I have a new test making them a wee bigger and doing a higher res STL file (tesselating the solid bodies). Look for that update tomorrow. 

 

 

[Jim Barry]

Just more thoughts on rivets. 

 

I'm using the nearly chrome plated examples to show the rivets to me, but clearly the painted planes are basically smooth. So, yes, I'm going to worry and all doing the riveting,  but overall, this is not a big thing. Those that do try to get that polished aluminum look (however you do that?) will perhaps appreciate the effort the most. I'll try to do testing tomorrow with Tamiya silver to get them to show up the most. There is, at the end of the day, riveting detail done by the builder and lots of creative ways there too. 

 

I'm really excited.  This is many times cooler than the seaplanes which of no fault of their own, are just simple. This is such a monster 

 

And finally, I just rubbed some pencil over the surface as a sort of dry brush effect and the rivets picked it up and provided a nice highlight. Very pleasing. More of that in testing too. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited August 19 by Jim Barry

[RCPlym]

Size matters - a 10mm rivet head equates to 0.3mm in 1/32.

How fine would the cutter need to be to produce the 'rings' needed to represent things like 426 countersunk rivets? 

 

[RCPlym]

3 hours ago, Jim Barry said:

OK on to testing these rivets which perhaps should have happened earlier but these smaller (possibly flush) rivets on the wing has me worried. So, Hubert suggested I model these as holes and I totally agree with that look, but it's a pain because holes are not bodies and do not "pattern" well. The work around seems to be a pain. With thousands of things I can't just create a bunch of columns, sink them and then cut the body they intersect. I did that with a few rivets on the cowl, but it's just not for mass production. Anyway, I decided to stay with the pop rivets and see what they really look like to the eye by printing them in 1/32. So this is under extreme magnification (primered with tamiya extra fine) and lots of sunlight and it's fine and the size seems very realistic, but in anything but perfect bright light, you can't see 'em! Which is interesting because that's why it seems there are no rivets in many pictures of the real thing. So..I don't know the exact value of this realistic portrayal when it all gets lost to normal human version in a room. I have a new test making them a wee bigger and doing a higher res STL file (tesselating the solid bodies). Look for that update tomorrow. 

 

 

 

Not sure if your Fusion can do the same as freecad with its Draft workbench where it can use an array to produce any number of rivet (or screw heads, nuts, dzus fasteners etc.) 'holes' or 'heads' along a path?

I made a single tiny cylinder and put 100 x 0.4mm holes across a compound curve. Setting boolean to cut made holes, setting it to fuse gave raised heads.