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HK B-17...D??? 12/11 bins for bullets

scratchbuild hk models B-17 metal rivets

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#736 brahman104

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Posted 17 September 2017 - 11:21 AM

That is just stunning. Is the kit really "unbuildable" OOB as I have read on so many forums?


Hahaha! Absolutely not mate! As Tom Probert said, there is absolutely nothing wrong with building the kit OOB. I went down this road because I wanted to do something different and to challenge myself. I have two more E/F kits in the stash and won't got to the same level I've gone here..... they will be much more OOB.

Don't be swayed by a lot of what you read here. As Tom said, shorten the U/C legs and you're in business!

Please post progress of your build..... nowhere near enough of these getting built.

Good luck!

Craig

#737 Gerhard

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Posted 17 September 2017 - 04:09 PM

Thanks Craig, have to get one first. Its my dream kit!!


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#738 ClumsyDude

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Posted 17 September 2017 - 10:02 PM

Craig, can't tell you how much I enjoy watching your work. Balls of steel to even try the ribs - let alone cut through them like you did!!! Amazing work.

Jim
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#739 Troy Molitor

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Posted 18 September 2017 - 08:54 AM

Hey Craig,

Do you have any markings picked out for your superb build in mind here? Just curious. Loving all the updates.

Troy
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#740 Dan Paxton

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Posted 18 September 2017 - 02:22 PM

All hail....the master has spoken :bow:


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#741 TKB

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Posted 19 September 2017 - 02:58 AM

Craig,

 

DAMN!

In my 9-14 post I was going to give you one of my infamous "don't forget abouts", concerning the left hand window, but it slipped my mind!

You recovered from it nicely, though.

 

By the way, did you get to view the E in Hawaii and D & F in Dayton?

 

Terry


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#742 Finn

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Posted 19 September 2017 - 05:12 PM

Amazing work Craig. Not the version you are doing but i think the interior is pretty much the same, the waist gunners area with the tail wheel structure at the back:
 
 
also note the control cables on top. The radio compartment:
 
 
 
Jari

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#743 brahman104

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Posted 19 September 2017 - 09:49 PM

 

 

By the way, did you get to view the E in Hawaii and D & F in Dayton?

 

I got to Swamp Ghost, but ran out of time for Dayton this trip....

 

hRaVjiB.jpg

 

Unfortunately, this was as close as it could get, as they had it in one corner of the hangar and fairly well roped off. Still, amazing to see for real something I'd read about for years and years.

 

 

DAMN!

In my 9-14 post I was going to give you one of my infamous "don't forget abouts", concerning the left hand window, but it slipped my mind!

You recovered from it nicely, though.

 

Hahaha, yeah my bad... I knew you'd be onto it though :) It certainly won't be the last time that happens in this build, but I always appreciate the quality control and progress check feedback!

 

 

Amazing work Craig. Not the version you are doing but i think the interior is pretty much the same, the waist gunners area with the tail wheel structure at the back:

 

 

Thanks Jari! The construction style between the models is similar, but there are several key differences between the earlier and later forts. I appreciate the photo posts though, anything like this is always worth its weight in gold. If not for this build, for the next one :)

 

 

 

Do you have any markings picked out for your superb build in mind here? Just curious. Loving all the updates. 

 

Hi Troy. Thanks so much for looking in on the build. My intent is to depict it more or less as "ole betsy" sometime around December 41. Information is pretty scarce on those chaotic days, so it will probably end up being a fictional representation, rather than an actual aircraft. It will be a natural metal finish though, so I still have quite a way to go yet! :)

 

 

 

Craig, can't tell you how much I enjoy watching your work. Balls of steel to even try the ribs - let alone cut through them like you did!!! Amazing work. 

 

 

Hi Jim! Can say exactly the same for your Hornet build and your battles with the gloss finish :) As for the corrective action on the fuselage, well that's a fairly big error, so it was pretty much as case of suck it up, it has to be done! Hopefully it won't have cost me too much on the overall look. Time will tell.

 

Thanks as always for your support and encouragement with this build guys, it means a lot and it does spur me on to do the best job I know how :)

 

Cheers,

 

Craig


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#744 Finn

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Posted 21 September 2017 - 12:08 AM

Craig some more future reference photos can be seen here:

 

http://images.google...757cae02dd.html

 

keep on clicking on the thumbnails under Related images to see many others. Note there are some reversed images among them.

 

Jari


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#745 brahman104

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Posted 21 September 2017 - 10:58 PM

Thanks again Jari. Any photo of a B-17 is always appreciated! :)

 

So being on night shift gained me some time to get the left side structure up to where the right is. I still need to address how I'm going to cover the joins in the ceiling, but I think I have a plan for that. I still need to detail around the tail wheel well, but for now here's a few more pics...

 

Al5w3v8.jpg?1

 

GvVmZPI.jpg

 

24fJOe5.jpg

 

Seeing as I was on a roll with making ribs and stringers, I figured I should start on the area under the cockpit where the forward entry door is. This area will be lit and so fairly visible. First things first was the "skin" on the left side as the right already had it. The join at the bottom is not so much of an issue here as there is a catwalk style floor in the centre which will hide the evidence nicely :)

 

pE3OrpJ.jpg

 

This is the second time I did this, because.......

 

VhbWu78.jpg

 

Idiot me didn't check how the door matched up to my guess at the hole size when I printed the part, so I just cut the metal back to the size of the hole. As you can see, the door is quite a different shape.... Now as I can't add metal that I've already removed, the only option was to install a new piece, fill the gaps with magic sculpt, then trace the actual door's shape and carefully remove only the required amount of material....... 90% of the time I am my own worst enemy.

 

vamMQ2X.jpg

 

Much better. Still got some fine tuning to do but it's getting there....

 

The door on the early models has quite a different internal structure to the later ones, so after thinking about it for a while, I figured modifying the kit part would be the best way to go.

 

KWNliIh.jpg?1

 

lj4eo1z.jpg

 

18GT9uc.jpg

 

I then annealed and formed the inner piece over the remains of the kit part. It took a while, but I got there in the end. 

 

4SIIIyb.jpg

 

Once that was done, I added the internal structure. Fiddly, but fun :)

 

HEa9oWI.jpg

 

It still needs the door handle and a few other details, but you get the idea....

 

bNB45Gf.jpg

 

And now lastly, even though the door will be open, just to see what it looks like inside....

 

zxqVUZi.jpg

 

Unfortunately, the fuselage sides are quite thick and there's not really a lot I can do about that, but the door rim has a stiffener around its edge anyway, so it will essentially look the same. Once again, the door will be open, but as you can see, it fits in there pretty well! :)

 

Now that's done, I can continue to build up the structure in this area..... Getting closer to being able to "move in" the various boxes, wires and lines that inhabit the fuselage, so things should start getting a little more exciting soon!

 

Cheers,

 

Craig


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#746 Cees Broere

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Posted 22 September 2017 - 06:15 AM

Very nicely done. About that window in the rear fuselage. Are you going to leave it like that?

Usually windows had a hoopframe to provide strength.

 

Cheers

Cees


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#747 TKB

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Posted 23 September 2017 - 09:39 PM

Craig,

 

The interior is looking more and more realistic with each post; your front entry hatch is really a nice piece of work.

I'm sure you already have the info, but just in case you don't, I mention it.

 

O2 Bottles:

 

Six (6) on the left fuselage between Bulkhead #6 and #7 about 2 o'clock position

Six (6) in the radio compartment (2 visible stacked under table and one between aux seats)

Three (3) under cockpit floor

Three (3) in nose opposite navigator

 

I'll send you the diagrams I came across for the O2 system and ammo can storage. They are for a B-17C, but probably would apply to the D.

 

Between the O2 bottles, ammo cans and belly bathtub, thats going to be one busy looking area looking into the main entry door!

 

Shame you weren't able to make Dayton. If antone deserves to be up close to a D --- it's you!

Like you said maybe next time. Memphis Belle is scheduled to be finished in about 6 months and then hopefully the D will get the focused attention and retored as Ole Betsy.

 

The photo of you with the E in Hawaii is very appropriate --- you and the B-17 "face"

 

 

Terry


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#748 brahman104

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Posted 23 September 2017 - 10:05 PM

Very nicely done. About that window in the rear fuselage. Are you going to leave it like that?
Usually windows had a hoopframe to provide strength.

Cheers
Cees


Thank Cees! I think I mentioned it in my last post but yes, I will be adding a hoop frame to the windows, including the nose ones so I can get the shapes right :)

Craig,

The interior is looking more and more realistic with each post; your front entry hatch is really a nice piece of work.
I'm sure you already have the info, but just in case you don't, I mention it.

O2 Bottles:

Six (6) on the left fuselage between Bulkhead #6 and #7 about 2 o'clock position
Six (6) in the radio compartment (2 visible stacked under table and one between aux seats)
Three (3) under cockpit floor
Three (3) in nose opposite navigator

I'll send you the diagrams I came across for the O2 system and ammo can storage. They are for a B-17C, but probably would apply to the D.

Between the O2 bottles, ammo cans and belly bathtub, thats going to be one busy looking area looking into the main entry door!

Shame you weren't able to make Dayton. If antone deserves to be up close to a D --- it's you!
Like you said maybe next time. Memphis Belle is scheduled to be finished in about 6 months and then hopefully the D will get the focused attention and retored as Ole Betsy.

The photo of you with the E in Hawaii is very appropriate --- you and the B-17 "face"


Terry


Thanks Terry! Yes I would have loved to get to the swoose...... there are a few YouTube tours on line but unfortunately most of the people taking them only flash a brief second or two of it..... so tantalisingly close yet so frustratingly far!!!!

Once again very timely info as I will be turning my attention to the oxygen system soon.... one thing I can't seem to track down is the dimensions for the bottles....... the perspective of the photos with bottles in them seems to indicate them being pretty big, but it's hard to judge...... I know the diagram you are thinking of so I might have to once again go best guess unless anyone has that info......

Just the last couple of days I've also been wondering if depicting a C instead of a D model would actually be cooler..... lack of cowl flaps, only a single gun in the radio room and bathtub so as not to obscure the view inside when the model is done........ at least those details can be pretty much added right at the end, what do you reckon?

I was also reading about mass balances for the elevators..... I thought I could almost make them out in photos but I'm not sure..... thoughts????
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#749 Finn

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Posted 24 September 2017 - 09:00 PM

Craig, i don't know if you have seen this pic or not:

 

https://airandspace....SM-XRA-0119.jpg

 

Jari


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#750 TKB

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Posted 25 September 2017 - 09:29 AM

Craig,

 

The "standard" O2 bottles (the ones with reinforcement straping) we usually see in USAAF heavy bombers are mostly described as being ~24 inches long with a diameter of  ~12 inches..

 

Just conjecture on my part, but the prior type (smooth surface) used in early B-17s was pretty close to those dimensions, but made from a heavier gauge metal. The change to the reinforced type was most likely cost and easier to mass produce.

 

Terry


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