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ITALERI F-35

F-35 IAF

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#16 Bruce_Crosby

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Posted 25 March 2017 - 12:00 PM

Hi Tony,

And here's me thinking I'm going crazy!

If I remember correctly the helmet systems are designed and built by BAe and they have to mesh with the base software intimately so I think any British add-ons will work. Israel is full of computer smart arses, mix that with a hard edge military and believe me, they will wring every drop of useability out of their planes.

And that lovely primer green would make a great model, can't wait to see what you can do. I've got a bottle of MRP Lemon Yellow Russian primer to whack onto a 1/48 Flanker, same idea, different plane.

Italeri will probably do the B, the Italian armed forces are buying the A and B versions with a lot of the assembly being done in Italy. That saves on the air fare to Lockheed!

Regards,

Bruce Crosby
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#17 Bruce_Crosby

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Posted 25 March 2017 - 01:03 PM

Just watching YouTube of a F-35 simulator with an instructor explaining the cockpit software in real time. Phenomenal!

Regards,

Bruce Crosby
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#18 Smitty44

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Posted 25 March 2017 - 02:50 PM

Coolest thing has to be that the airframe has a whole bunch of cameras and sensors on the fuselage so the pilot can flip a switch and essentially make the aircraft dissapear around him so he can "see" right through it.


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#19 dsahling1

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Posted 25 March 2017 - 07:05 PM

I used to be a flight instructor in the civilian world (sadly not a fighter or bomber pilot) :-(.  One of my favorite things was when I student would bring along one of those really nice garmin color GPS with all the bells and whistles to boot.  We'd start flying somewhere and they'd start calling out their arrival times, staying on course very nicely....then I would reach over and press the power button and say,  your GPS just malfunctioned or ran out of power, and lets say storm clouds are building along our initial route I want you to take us to airport XYZ." Usually the first time around they had a hard time finding where I wanted them to go.  I used it as an object lesson that technology should be used a tool to help you improve your navigation and dead-reckoning skills (and if you use a GPS to help identify landmarks, roads, terrain etc and improve your depth perception/distance visualizing its great).  But using an E6B might seem tricky at first but its actually much easier and quicker to use than trying to type in a bunch of tiny numbers on a small screen when you should be looking outside.  In regards to the F-35 I'm worried the technology MIGHT not always work properly and we could become overly reliant on it, and flying straight and level relying on computers to see and avoid SAMs and threats might be a bad idea.  Don't get me wrong, a system that can identify and detect a launch is great and even indicate the general direction is a good thing.  But I worry this plane could really get a lot of pilots in trouble.  (Ducks for cover)


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#20 Smitty44

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Posted 25 March 2017 - 07:08 PM

I used to be a flight instructor in the civilian world (sadly not a fighter or bomber pilot) :-(.  One of my favorite things was when I student would bring along one of those really nice garmin color GPS with all the bells and whistles to boot.  We'd start flying somewhere and they'd start calling out their arrival times, staying on course very nicely....then I would reach over and press the power button and say,  your GPS just malfunctioned or ran out of power, and lets say storm clouds are building along our initial route I want you to take us to airport XYZ." Usually the first time around they had a hard time finding where I wanted them to go.  I used it as an object lesson that technology should be used a tool to help you improve your navigation and dead-reckoning skills (and if you use a GPS to help identify landmarks, roads, terrain etc and improve your depth perception/distance visualizing its great).  But using an E6B might seem tricky at first but its actually much easier and quicker to use than trying to type in a bunch of tiny numbers on a small screen when you should be looking outside.  In regards to the F-35 I'm worried the technology MIGHT not always work properly and we could become overly reliant on it, and flying straight and level relying on computers to see and avoid SAMs and threats might be a bad idea.  Don't get me wrong, a system that can identify and detect a launch is great and even indicate the general direction is a good thing.  But I worry this plane could really get a lot of pilots in trouble.  (Ducks for cover)

One would hope people in the program would think of this as well.


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#21 wunwinglow

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Posted 25 March 2017 - 07:58 PM

Technology has always been a doubled edged weapon. I bet the guy who invented the plough share thought he was the bees knees until it broke on a big stone. Then discovered his brother the blacksmith had just doubled his rush rates.....
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#22 Adam

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Posted 26 March 2017 - 01:00 AM

I used to be a flight instructor in the civilian world (sadly not a fighter or bomber pilot) :-(.  One of my favorite things was when I student would bring along one of those really nice garmin color GPS with all the bells and whistles to boot.  We'd start flying somewhere and they'd start calling out their arrival times, staying on course very nicely....then I would reach over and press the power button and say,  your GPS just malfunctioned or ran out of power, and lets say storm clouds are building along our initial route I want you to take us to airport XYZ." Usually the first time around they had a hard time finding where I wanted them to go.  I used it as an object lesson that technology should be used a tool to help you improve your navigation and dead-reckoning skills (and if you use a GPS to help identify landmarks, roads, terrain etc and improve your depth perception/distance visualizing its great).  But using an E6B might seem tricky at first but its actually much easier and quicker to use than trying to type in a bunch of tiny numbers on a small screen when you should be looking outside.  In regards to the F-35 I'm worried the technology MIGHT not always work properly and we could become overly reliant on it, and flying straight and level relying on computers to see and avoid SAMs and threats might be a bad idea.  Don't get me wrong, a system that can identify and detect a launch is great and even indicate the general direction is a good thing.  But I worry this plane could really get a lot of pilots in trouble.  (Ducks for cover)

 

You make some great points regarding the reliance to technology. So agree with your instructing technique regarding GPS. Even in something like a Pitts or Laser, using a E6B is pretty impossible - the time old method of sticking to the red line on a map marked off with 10 nm increments, wet compass and watch has to do. I've friends who do of course swear by iPad flight planning software like "OzRunways", which gives one a moving map plus all the other benefits. One must be prepared though for when this tech fails, weather forces a divert at low altitude as per your example. Also interesting your point regarding the tech in the F-35. The very first generation jammers (QRC-160) used by F-105 crews over North Vietnam required pretty tight formations to ensure proper coverage. These pods were practically hand made and rushed into combat. It must have taken massive brass ones to fly the jamming profile correctly for these pods to have a chance of working, then the dreaded MiG warnings would have broken up these tight jamming formations, etc and that jamming formation would go to ****. Of course this technology along with the tactics have evolved enormously over the last 50 years. Exercises like Red Flag are there to find holes in tactics and technology - hopefully. The "Wests" potential adversaries have nothing like Red Flag and are generally regarded to be way behind (as much as 10 years) in a number of key technologies (stealth, AESA radar, jet engine, sensor fusion), nor are there the shear weight of numbers to counter more advanced tech like in the Soviet era (thousands of MiG-21s). Red Flag did prove that it's possible for adversaries to get lucky and get through to F-35s, but it took a very very large number of adversaries to do this - probably way more than would ever be possible in real life. The adversaries were able to regenerate a number of times and were able to get lucky and visually acquire F-35s on a very few occasions. Once the F-35 will be able to carry more AIM-120s internally (currently 2 and will go up to 4, then 6) and use the AIM-9X & AIM-132 ASRAAMs, this will make it pretty well impossible to take out any meaningful number of F-35s in a strike group. All these assets are networked together - from AEW&C, jammer/SEAD fighters like E-18Gs, 5th gen fighters, other 4th Gen fighters and bombers, other space, air and ground based ISR assets - this makes it very very hard for any potential adversaries. The users themselves seem very happy with the F-35 so far. All of we on the outside of this program can do is either accept or reject this, but this changes nothing of course to we the "great unwashed"!. Service chiefs and the air & ground crews appear very happy with the F-35 so far and that's good enough for me.



#23 Peterpools

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Posted 26 March 2017 - 01:21 AM

Since we're off topic a bit anyway; I learned to fly in the days before GPS, before PC's, before iPads and cell phones. Matter of fact even before calculators. My first cross countries were in a J3: no radios of any sort - just a few steam driven gauges, a mag compass, a sectional and maybe a road map. We learned the ways of the E6B and while it took a while, we always showed up. Moving up to high tech in Piper Cherokees, and Cessna C150's and Skyhawks: the beauty of the VORs and learning to use the navcoms from NARCO and ARC. Now that was living. Even with those marvels of navigation, loads of short XC's  were by dead reckoning and pilotage. Of course, navcoms of even that age will and did fail and it's nice to know how to read a map and fly a mag compass.

Peter


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#24 dsahling1

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Posted 26 March 2017 - 02:13 AM

Since we're off topic a bit anyway; I learned to fly in the days before GPS, before PC's, before iPads and cell phones. Matter of fact even before calculators. My first cross countries were in a J3: no radios of any sort - just a few steam driven gauges, a mag compass, a sectional and maybe a road map. We learned the ways of the E6B and while it took a while, we always showed up. Moving up to high tech in Piper Cherokees, and Cessna C150's and Skyhawks: the beauty of the VORs and learning to use the navcoms from NARCO and ARC. Now that was living. Even with those marvels of navigation, loads of short XC's  were by dead reckoning and pilotage. Of course, navcoms of even that age will and did fail and it's nice to know how to read a map and fly a mag compass.

Peter

 

We sometimes used to do "IFR"..... "I follow roads"  :-)


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