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Using Pigments?


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#1 G-Man

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Posted 07 November 2017 - 01:55 PM

I picked up the AK Exhaust Stains Weathering Set some time ago, but I am unsure how to use the pigments. The set comes with a dark brown wash and three different colored pigments. I also have bottles of AK Pigment Fixer and AK White Spirit. There are no directions and I have been unable to find a tutorial online. I just want to put black smoky exhaust trails on my model. How do I create that with this set? Or am I better off airbrushing the trails on with flat black paint?
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#2 Out2gtcha

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Posted 07 November 2017 - 02:10 PM

Pigments can be different to use. Generally you need something like this:

 

mig-pigments-pigment-fixer-by-mig-produc

 

 

 

The pigment fixer can be used in a multitude of ways, including spraying or brushing it OVER the pigments to get a certain type of effect, OR as I do, you can brush or spray the fixer on UNDER the pigment and sprinkle the pigment on.



#3 Out2gtcha

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Posted 07 November 2017 - 02:23 PM

Generally pigments are not used for exhaust stains of the type you are looking to do. Mostly pigments are for raising or changing the texture of something to make it stand out. You can also add the pigments to paint to change tone, or add them to other weathering products such as washes.

 

 

You can create black smoky trails with an airbrush and some Tamiya smoke, or the like, but keep in mind the Smoke is glossy, so a flat coat is usually needed. If you dont want to airbrush the exhaust stains, I have also had great luck with Tamiyas "Weathering Pallets" for exhaust stains too:

 

41rX%2BxGqwTL.jpg

 

 

They are effectivly a modeling "make up case" for weathering, and come in a vast array of 3 section pallets.These are excellent for exhaust stains IMHO, as you can use the makeup style brushes to add nice looking exhaust streaks, and if you dont like them you can wipe them off with alcohol.   You can also airbrush OVER the streaks made by the weathering pallets to get a typical two tone look as well.     I would do some experimenting to see what kind of look you like. 

 

HTH


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#4 G-Man

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Posted 07 November 2017 - 02:58 PM

I have not seen the Tamiya set before, interesting. Amazon has all the sets for $40 with Prime shipping, which isn't bad really.

I may have to go the airbrush route, using light coats of Mr Color flat black until it looks right. I'll just have to practice a bit beforehand as my precision airbrush skills are not totally there yet.
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ON THE BENCH: Eduard 1/32 Bf 109E7

ON DECK: Trumpeter 1/32 Ju 87B2

                   


#5 Out2gtcha

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Posted 07 November 2017 - 03:06 PM

I have not seen the Tamiya set before, interesting. Amazon has all the sets for $40 with Prime shipping, which isn't bad really.

I may have to go the airbrush route, using light coats of Mr Color flat black until it looks right. I'll just have to practice a bit beforehand as my precision airbrush skills are not totally there yet.

 

 

Indeed. The thing about the pigments is they can appear quite thick if laid on over the fixer, and usually exhaust stains are more streaky, but not very prominent as far as thickness or texture. 


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#6 TonyT

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Posted 07 November 2017 - 03:28 PM

I use them all the time, for using pigment you heap it on where you want it then add the fixer and it will wick through it to hold it fast, the others are washes, and you add them amd they will wick around objects etc, I will link you to some guides.,

 

 

Ok AK video guides are here

 

https://www.youtube....TfRsVsedEpJkr8w

 

Downloadable and readable guides for their range of products and some helpful how to guides are here

 

https://ak-interactive.com/downloads/

 

Mig step by step guides here

 

http://www.migjimene...mo-step-by-step


Edited by TonyT, 07 November 2017 - 03:29 PM.


#7 TonyT

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Posted 07 November 2017 - 03:34 PM

This shows exhaust

 

http://www.ak-master...ACK PIGMENT.pdf

 

from the Beau one

 

http://www.ak-master...BEAUFIGHTER.pdf

 

I seal my pigments with a Humbrol matt varnish rattle can btw, then add any of the oil i need over it


Edited by TonyT, 07 November 2017 - 03:40 PM.

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#8 G-Man

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Posted 07 November 2017 - 03:49 PM

This shows exhaust

http://www.ak-master...ACK PIGMENT.pdf


So if I'm understanding this right, I dry brush the pigments on, which can be smeared into a cloudy effect? And then seal them with white spirit?

ON THE BENCH: Eduard 1/32 Bf 109E7

ON DECK: Trumpeter 1/32 Ju 87B2

                   


#9 TonyT

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Posted 07 November 2017 - 04:05 PM

yes you can, or the pigment fixer I seal mine with matt varnish, they will fade a bit when you do it.

 

 

Try doing it on a bit of scrap plasic, the washes can be added, let wick around where you want them or paint on as streaks, let them dry then use a lightly wet brush of white spirit to draw them out, drag them down etc and blend in.


Edited by TonyT, 07 November 2017 - 04:06 PM.

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#10 G-Man

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Posted 07 November 2017 - 04:38 PM

yes you can, or the pigment fixer I seal mine with matt varnish, they will fade a bit when you do it.

https://www.youtube....h?v=Y2bdNr-SRb4

Try doing it on a bit of scrap plasic, the washes can be added, let wick around where you want them or paint on as streaks, let them dry then use a lightly wet brush of white spirit to draw them out, drag them down etc and blend in.


Do I apply the pigments onto a gloss or flat coat? Also, is there any difference between the fixer and the white spirit?

ON THE BENCH: Eduard 1/32 Bf 109E7

ON DECK: Trumpeter 1/32 Ju 87B2

                   


#11 Zero77

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Posted 07 November 2017 - 04:49 PM

I usually paint my smoke trails with very thinned (about 5 or 10% paint for 90/95% alcohol) brown or/and black flat acrylic paint. So you can adjust what you want and build up the trail as you want. For example you can spray a first light coat of brown, and then intensify it just aft the exhaust with black or a darker brown. Almost every aircraft have different pattern of smoke stain, so it's up to you.

 

Adding some pigments can also help to get interesting effects, but making smoke trails only with pigments may indeed be a bit difficult.


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#12 TonyT

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Posted 07 November 2017 - 05:39 PM

 

Do I apply the pigments onto a gloss or flat coat? Also, is there any difference between the fixer and the white spirit?

 

 

Not sure, when I do my tanks I do it onto the matt paint, I think you will find the white spirit is more to subtly blend the washes or pigment, the fixer I use when applying muds and soil or heavy pigment applications.etc. This is the mud applied heavy , it is a combination of Mig mud that is ready mixed and also AK mud pigments,

 

P38T%20complete%201%20of%201_zpszn6ijrvg

 

Model%20update%203-1_zpssa5ends6.jpg

 

P38T%20complete%20main%205%20of%201_zpsx

 

This shows the mud pigments colours added behind the wheels and fixed with the fixer

 

Tank%202-12_zps1padd9cv.jpg


Edited by TonyT, 07 November 2017 - 05:39 PM.

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#13 Zero77

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Posted 07 November 2017 - 07:31 PM

Not sure that the pigment would stick on a glossy finish (except if fixed with a coat of clear coat). A matt finish holds the pigments nicely, if you just brush them in a very thin coat, you almost dont have to use any fixer. But if so, just avoid to touch the surface as you can do a nice fingerprint. (even if you used some fixer, though). If you sprayed a clear coat, that's ok.


Edited by Zero77, 07 November 2017 - 07:33 PM.

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Following the big Photobucket rip-off attempt, all my pictures on the forum cannot display anymore. I try to reupload the RFI pictures, but i'm not sure i'd have enough time and energy to reupload the pictures of the WIP threads. If you're interested in a specific subject and want me to reupload some pictures, just let me know. :) 
 
Finished : F-16C Barak, F-4J VMF333, Czech Mig-19PM, Bell X-1, Russian Su-25 in Chechnya, Ta152H-1, Czech Avia S.199, Heinkel He162, Swiss AF Bf109G-6, Regia Aeronautica Bf109G-6, P-47D "Slick Chick", RFC Sopwith Pup, A5M2 Claude, Schneider Cup 1926 Macchi M.39, German F-104G JaboG34, Curtiss P-6E, Curtiss P-36A USAAC, Piper SuperCub floatplane (PA-18-150), Russian built Nieuport 11, Albatros D.Va Seefrontstaffel 1, Bf109G-12 (two-seater trainer), Texas ANG F-86D,  Post-war Hawker Tempest Mk.V

 


#14 G-Man

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Posted 07 November 2017 - 08:24 PM

Not sure that the pigment would stick on a glossy finish (except if fixed with a coat of clear coat). A matt finish holds the pigments nicely, if you just brush them in a very thin coat, you almost dont have to use any fixer. But if so, just avoid to touch the surface as you can do a nice fingerprint. (even if you used some fixer, though). If you sprayed a clear coat, that's ok.


Ok, I think I'll apply them after I seal my washes with flat clear. Then seal the pigments with another coat of flat clear.

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#15 CATCplSlade

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Posted 07 November 2017 - 08:45 PM

Bear in mind though the sealer might darken the pigments.
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