Hubert Boillot Posted July 1, 2017 Share Posted July 1, 2017 (edited) The 307 definitely has overlapping panels on the fuselage, not sure (but not very knowledgeable, admittedly) about the fin of the B-17. I need to get back to modelling and complete some stalled projects before I can consider the 307 ... Maybe the effect is just a tad too pronounced because the thickness of the alu is not "scale-like". If so, I have not yet found a solution for you (and me in the future ) ... Hubert Edited July 1, 2017 by MostlyRacers brahman104 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brahman104 Posted July 1, 2017 Author Share Posted July 1, 2017 Totally agree Hubert If the gaps were that big on the real thing I don't think Boeing's sheet metal workers would have stayed employed for too long! Unfortunately, unless I switch to a thinner metal (I guess foil really), I'll have to live with this effect, but I might get better at it after doing a couple of thousand of them A few years ago I saw this guy from the Ukraine covering models in Aluminium, one was a 1/72 DC-3. Possibly the most amazing display of awesomeness ever. He now lives in Canada I do believe. http://precisemodeling.com If anyone has the answer to our problems, it's him Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LSP_Kevin Posted July 1, 2017 Share Posted July 1, 2017 A few years ago I saw this guy from the Ukraine covering models in Aluminium, one was a 1/72 DC-3. Possibly the most amazing display of awesomeness ever. He now lives in Canada I do believe. http://precisemodeling.com If anyone has the answer to our problems, it's him Craig I believe his name is Alex Skylar. I've been following his Facebook page for some time now: https://www.facebook.com/PreciseModeling/ Well worth checking out his scratch-built 1/32 Loire 130. Here's a sample I sneaked off his Facebook page: Kev sandokan, Hubert Boillot, brahman104 and 1 other 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LSP_Kevin Posted July 1, 2017 Share Posted July 1, 2017 Oh, I forgot to mention: terrific work, Craig - correct or not! Kev brahman104 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TKB Posted July 1, 2017 Share Posted July 1, 2017 Craig, From what I can see from photos of Ole Betsy/Swoose sharkfin, the skin is overlapping joints, as you have it. Yeah, I see those vertical rows of rivets are on an angle. One of those SOB/MF moments we all experience at one time or another! Research, research, research --- and something always manages to bite you in the ass! Still a beautiful piece of work and I seriously doubt it will detract from the finished model ---- except to you, right? As far as the "non scale gap" on the joints, perhaps now is one of those times for artistic liberty. I'm talking as a totally inexperienced amateur here. Could you go with butt joints, slightly tapering the edge of the "underlaying" skin to simulate a lapped skin joint? With a very light wash along the joint may enhance a lapped joint effect. Styrene, metal, 3D printing, riveting machines and you throw in some old fashioned "stick and tissue" on the rudder! You are not above using anything --- and that is meant as a compliment! Terry brahman104 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brahman104 Posted July 1, 2017 Author Share Posted July 1, 2017 True indeed Terry! As much as I did spend a long time on the fin, knowing that those pictures exist (the weird thing is that I HAD been staring at them for ages, but for the structure of the rudder!) I'm more than likely going to go back and have another crack at it. I'll chalk the first one up for experience, but I certainly think I can do better second time around. It's amazing how many times you can stare at a photo and not see some detail! I know Peter did talk about feathering the edges of the lower panels, but I think you're definitely on to something with your suggestion..... I'll do some experimentation. I'm also wondering if I can 3D print the fin, and include some step in the process........ hmmmm, lots to think about. I'm also still struggling with the trim tabs. They are proving exceedingly difficult to nail on account of their trailing edge. Back to the (digital) drawing board I think Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brahman104 Posted July 2, 2017 Author Share Posted July 2, 2017 Here's my reference pic from the Peter Bowers book...... I don't know if I'm seeing things but it looks like they are actually flush rivets on the fin too........ The horizontal stab would seem to agree with me.... And my nemesis trim tabs..... grrrrr! I'm going to see if I can chance a lucky photo of the fin or stab from the Swoose, but to me this is evidence enough that I should rebuild..... Stay tuned! Craig sandokan, Gazzas, Derek B and 2 others 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Barry Posted July 2, 2017 Share Posted July 2, 2017 I really liked your rudder, but wondered if you conclude it was just an iteration. You can look back on my Fury and see how psyched I was with version one, but the one I finally accepted was version 9! I always enjoy your updates. Keep it up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClumsyDude Posted July 2, 2017 Share Posted July 2, 2017 Bloody hell Craig ... you are just nailing it mate! That skinning is brilliant. Cheers Jim PS how's your ultra training coming on? Not a bad time of year for it in Townsville I imagine! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TKB Posted July 8, 2017 Share Posted July 8, 2017 Craig, I can recall many a time I poured over a photo so long that I felt like it was imprinted in my memory (and you know how I can get obsessed over somethings!). Then looking at the same photo later on, had the same thing happen to me about some obvious detail --- "where the hell did that come from!" and "who tampered with the photo!" Now, why did I have this feeling that the fin would turn into a prototype? I've said it before, to your credit, you do not shy away from "do overs". Like the rivet pattern not being on an angle. I'm sure 99.9% would never notice --- but you'd know. I believe that's what they call striving for perfection. A trait that constantly shows up in all your work. Terry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChuckD Posted July 10, 2017 Share Posted July 10, 2017 Such awesome work. Loving every update. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brahman104 Posted July 25, 2017 Author Share Posted July 25, 2017 I really liked your rudder, but wondered if you conclude it was just an iteration. You can look back on my Fury and see how psyched I was with version one, but the one I finally accepted was version 9! I always enjoy your updates. Keep it up. I hear you mate! I thought I was all over the first one, but the longer I looked at it the more I saw things I could improve, so out comes the new version Bloody hell Craig ... you are just nailing it mate! That skinning is brilliant. Cheers Jim PS how's your ultra training coming on? Not a bad time of year for it in Townsville I imagine! Thanks Jim! I'm starting to get a handle on the skinning process now. Not quite as easy as it looks, but manageable Ah yes the running..... well due to work the last few weeks I have been unable to train, but given that I leave for Canada on Sunday and the race is the following Saturday, I've decided to call it my taper. I'm kidding myself I know but as long as I make it before the cutoff I'll be happy! I'll let you know how I go Craig, I can recall many a time I poured over a photo so long that I felt like it was imprinted in my memory (and you know how I can get obsessed over somethings!). Then looking at the same photo later on, had the same thing happen to me about some obvious detail --- "where the hell did that come from!" and "who tampered with the photo!" Now, why did I have this feeling that the fin would turn into a prototype? I've said it before, to your credit, you do not shy away from "do overs". Like the rivet pattern not being on an angle. I'm sure 99.9% would never notice --- but you'd know. I believe that's what they call striving for perfection. A trait that constantly shows up in all your work. Terry 100% Terry. There's some saying about not seeing what's right in front of you sometimes....... Going back and having another crack did allow me to address a few things which were nagging me, so hopefully I've got it sorted this time! Such awesome work. Loving every update. Thanks mate! Won't be any more for a while as I'm away for about a month, but rest assured if I don't get eaten by a bear I'll be back Continuing on....... As we know from the last episode, I had several epiphanies in regards to the tail and fin. First of all, I completely messed up the rivet pattern. Secondly, the rivets on the tail surfaces appear to be flush, not universal like the rest of the plane. Thirdly, I had struggled with the airfoil shape of the fin itself, resulting in an unrealistically "fat" fin and rudder. I came across the website airfoil.com and picked one of the NACA profiles. I then re-drew the new fin in Rhino and a few hours later I had the new shape.... I think you'll agree, the profile is much better I then concentrated on skinning the fin and getting the rivet pattern right. I'm starting to get a grip on the skinning process and Peter's masking tape technique for determining the panel shape is spot on. With the two versions together, I think I have a winner...... So that's all I've got for a while. I haven't been overly convinced with the tissue paper coating, so I'll probably just try and simulate it with putty. I've got a bit of time to think about how to approach the next step...... Cheers, Craig Shawn M, Bill Cross, Derek B and 3 others 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cees Broere Posted July 25, 2017 Share Posted July 25, 2017 That's quite an improvement. Your perseverance is legendary already. brahman104 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomprobert Posted July 25, 2017 Share Posted July 25, 2017 Version 2.0 does look much better. The rivets look more in scale, too. As Cees says, your perseverance is admirable! I just know it'll be worth it in the end, when a truly unique model of an early Forteess sits proudly on the display table! Tom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LSP_Kevin Posted July 25, 2017 Share Posted July 25, 2017 Fantastic work, Craig! Kev brahman104 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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