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Kitty Hawk 1/32 F-5E/F Tiger II / Special Interest Group (SIG) !


SharkOwl

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Guest Airfixer

Is the KH seat then short in scale? Or does it sit too high?

 

The seat is too short in scale, the entire KH headrest/drogue chute container assembly is too compressed.

Also, the seat bucket is a wee bit too shallow. 

 

Despite the long (and growing) list of errors, omissions and "not-so's", KH thankfully failed in ruining the overall look and feel of the F-5E. As in many other cases, the devil is in the details. Depending on timeframe, operator, airframe production configuration, mods, retrofits, etc.

 

Some of the bloopers may make some folks want to tear their hair out, but in the end it solely depends on each modeller's individual susceptibility to AMS and perception of accuracy to rate the significance of our findings.

Edited by Airfixer
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Some of the bloopers may make some folks want to tear their hair out, but in the end it solely depends on each modeller's individual susceptibility to AMS and perception of accuracy to rate the significance of our findings.

 

 

Well said. 

 

To be honest, I am falling out of love with this kit, the more I hear about it. I have been bitten by Kitty Hawk before, with their 1/48 Jaguar GR3, and they don't seem to have improved much. Just my opinion looking from afar. I am open to having my mind changed, the F-5 is a lovely looking airplane...

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I have been bitten by Kitty Hawk before, with their 1/48 Jaguar GR3, and they don't seem to have improved much. 

 

 

I can understand that, its a terrible kit IMHO. However they definitely have improved............markedly actually.  Their T-28 fits like a dream, although it still has some known Kitty Hawk head scratchers in it, but just minor stuff.  The kit itself fits excellent, and its a super fun build.  

 

Minus any of the above mentioned issues, if the fit of the kit is anything like their T-28, accuracy aside, the fit should be outstanding

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Guest Smitty44

Well does the cockpit actually sit behind the main nose wheel well as opposed to on top of it? There are aftermarket seats already so deepening the cockpit could be possible, or if they hopefull pop out some more Avionix cockpits it should work out.

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the first builds/videos and preview show some decent fit . only some typical Y moments but nothing bad unless you lack basic tools and skill .there is absolutely no problem if you know how to read instructions and build a kit . 

 

it can be a bit frustrating but nothing that can break the entire build . 

 

 

the result itself is worth those efforts . at least for me , knowing all we know on this thread and others it doesn't blown out my candle light !

 

 

and there are quite a few AM parts coming for the fin , IP , exhaust etc so just finish your build , enjoy the weather and when you come back everything will be perfect for you do build it .

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Guest Smitty44

the first builds/videos and preview show some decent fit . only some typical Y moments but nothing bad unless you lack basic tools and skill .there is absolutely no problem if you know how to read instructions and build a kit . 

 

it can be a bit frustrating but nothing that can break the entire build . 

 

 

the result itself is worth those efforts . at least for me , knowing all we know on this thread and others it doesn't blown out my candle light !

 

 

and there are quite a few AM parts coming for the fin , IP , exhaust etc so just finish your build , enjoy the weather and when you come back everything will be perfect for you do build it .

 

Preach it!!

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A markings heads up:

 

In looking at photos in preparation for doing the 425 TFTS silver F-5E included in the Kittyhawk decal options, I saw some indications that the kit decals for wing insignia and USAF may be miss-sized.    I couldn't find any good in-flight photos of plan view for this squadron, but I did find several good photos of parked aircraft.   All of these show either the insignia (underside starboard) or the USAF (underside port) overlapping with the gear doors.   The Kittyhawk instructions would position these markings outboard of the gear doors.   It appears that even if you shifted the decals inboard to create overlap with the doors, things would not look correct, as the whole marking would be too far inboard. 

 

 I 'think' the wing insignia and USAF are one size too small.

 

If anyone has the photos, time, and inclination to check my tentative conclusion, I would appreciate a second set of eyes on this and a wave-off if I'm wrong.  Or does anyone have a T.O. showing how these early F-5Es were supposed to be marked?   Size and position of the markings?

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Guest Airfixer

@Tom

 

Affirmative, the corresponding KH decals for the 20" wing USAF lettering are grossly undersized.

The fuselage markings are largely complying with applicable technical orders: 9" radio call numbers and 20" fuselage national insignia. Later (1979 onwards), individual a/c had their call numbers changed from 9" to 12" cap height.

 

As to the the 12" fwd fuselage U.S. AIR FORCE lettering KH is off the mark - again. The KH decals roughly equate to a 10" cap height.

 

Wing markings/insignia:

In general, it depends on timeframe.

Early variations (1975-1979) of the Aluminised PUR Topcoat finish featured 30" national insignia and 20" USAF lettering. After later repaints (1979-1981) the corresponding a/c had smaller 20" national insignia applied. Even in 1980, 1981 and 1982 you could still find individual aircraft depicting the large 30" insignia. KH wing national insignia = 20".

 

Placement:

KH got the placement wrong. Beyond, KH utterly ignored one of the most characteristic features of the "silver" scheme - the 36" top/bottom wingtip conspicuity markings with 3" black borders. Rien, nada, zilch.

 

The KH marking option for 72-1401 depicts the early (pre-1979) timeframe. And yet, and despite of consistent marking sizes,the actual placement of wing insignia and markings could vary slightly from one a/c to another.

 

General placement of top/bottom wing markings based on photographs (pre-1979 timeframe):

 

R2ErBus.jpg

 

pqjfv69.jpg

 

1979 (and onwards) variation, 20" wing national insignia:

(8" wingtip conspicuity markings clearance)

LEOf4ri.jpg

 

b4M3JXN.jpg

 

 

Another (minor) KH marking glitch:

Vertical tail fin tip (immediately above the tail conspicuity markings) -> painted in FS 16473 Aircraft Gray.

 

HTH

 

Erik

 

â–º F-5E Markings Tweak List - Kittyhawk proposed marking options versus kit content/kit plastic: http://forum.largesc...66843&p=1031030 

Edited by Airfixer
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Thank you!    I selected this a/c as my first build because it looked like an easy-to-do color and markings scheme.   Maybe I'll be lucky and find appropriate sized insignia and USAF decals in my spare decals collection.   Or switch to another version I can build with kit decals.   Or wait for aftermarket decals to be released.

 

The more I work with this kit and follow the messages on this SIG, the more I wonder how a major, well established, kit company can allow such careless research and quality control in what seems like dozens of aspects of the kit.  They should have contracted with you as a consultant! 

 

In spite of these many small (and correctable) errors, I still think it is a pretty good kit and will certainly build several.   I just like the aircraft!

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Guest Airfixer

(...)

In spite of these many small (and correctable) errors, I still think it is a pretty good kit and will certainly build several.   I just like the aircraft!

 

Agreed. 100%. I love the F-5E.

 

 

(...)

They should have contracted with you as a consultant! 

 

I must confess that's not quite my concept of having fun.

And even calling in a bunch of truly competent experts won't necessarily result in a great and well thought-out kit. Just my 2 Eurocents.

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The F-5E is not my "cup-of-tea", but I have nevertheless followed with great interest this thread.

 

And I just wanted to praise everyone here for the way the thread has developed and flourished. LSP spirit in its greatest form.

 

Here comes an eagerly awaited kit, that turns out to be a good kit, but not without its flaws. In other places, these flaws would have ignited fire and flak, with some drastic conclusions like "It's unbuildable. KH have - again - f**** it up" (remember some threads on the WNW junkers J-1 with its missing piece of trailing edge, or the Zoukei-Mura Ta-152 ? ).

 

Here, the flaws have been calmly analyzed, and solutions provided, all of them within reach of an average modeller. This thread has proved most useful and enjoyable to read, even for the uninterested-in-the-subject modeller like me. So kudos and thank you to all participants.

 

And a very special "hip-hip-hip-hurrah !" for Erik (Airfixer) who has relentlessly provided detailed and clear explanations about issues and how to fix them :goodjob:

 

If I ever change my mind about building a 1/32 F-5E, I know where to look.

 

Hubert.

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The F-5E is not my "cup-of-tea", but I have nevertheless followed with great interest this thread.

 

And I just wanted to praise everyone here for the way the thread has developed and flourished. LSP spirit in its greatest form.

 

Here comes an eagerly awaited kit, that turns out to be a good kit, but not without its flaws. In other places, these flaws would have ignited fire and flak, with some drastic conclusions like "It's unbuildable. KH have - again - f**** it up" (remember some threads on the WNW junkers J-1 with its missing piece of trailing edge, or the Zoukei-Mura Ta-152 ? ).

 

Here, the flaws have been calmly analyzed, and solutions provided, all of them within reach of an average modeller. This thread has proved most useful and enjoyable to read, even for the uninterested-in-the-subject modeller like me. So kudos and thank you to all participants.

 

And a very special "hip-hip-hip-hurrah !" for Erik (Airfixer) who has relentlessly provided detailed and clear explanations about issues and how to fix them :goodjob:

 

If I ever change my mind about building a 1/32 F-5E, I know where to look.

 

Hubert.

 

 

 

If only we should be so lucky to have a thread and SMEs like this for all new models that come out! 

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Guest Airfixer

Well does the cockpit actually sit behind the main nose wheel well as opposed to on top of it? There are aftermarket seats already so deepening the cockpit could be possible, or if they hopefull pop out some more Avionix cockpits it should work out.

 

Yes, the cockpit is located aft of the kit's gun bay/wheel well subassembly.

Below the cockpit tub there's enough room for improvement - literally.

 

 

7Zuplh2.jpg

Edited by Airfixer
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